DefenseTech Military.com
  • Categories
  • Full Archives
  • Monthly Archives
  • About Defense Tech
Subscribe to RSS

About Defense Tech

Defense Tech exam­ines the inter­sec­tion of tech­nol­ogy and defense from every angle and pro­vides analy­sis on what’s ahead.

Tip Us Off

Tip for Defense Tech?

SEND IT!

It’s Confidential!

Categories

  • 'Canes
  • Afghan Update
  • Ammo and Munitions
  • Armor
  • Around the Globe
  • Av Week Extra
  • Axe in Iraq (and Elsewhere)
  • Bizarro
  • Blimps
  • Blog Bidness
  • Body Armor Blues
  • Bomb Squad
  • Brownshoes in Action
  • Bubbleheads, etc.
  • Cammo Green
  • Catch the "Buzz"
  • Chem-Bio
  • Civilian Apps
  • Cloak and Dagger
  • Commandos
  • Comms
  • Contingency Ops
  • Cops and Robbers
  • Cyber-warfare
  • Data Diving
  • Defense Tech Poll
  • Defense Tech Radio
  • Dissent Tech
  • Door Kickers
  • Drones
  • DT Administrivia
  • Eat DT's Dust
  • Extra! Extra!
  • Eye on China
  • Fast Movers
  • FCS Watch
  • Fire for Effect
  • FOS Files
  • Friday Funnies
  • Gadgets and Gear
  • Going Green
  • Grand Ole Osprey
  • Ground Vehicles
  • Guns
  • Homeland Security
  • In the Weeds with Eric
  • Info War
  • Iraq Diary
  • Jarhead Jazz
  • JSF Watch
  • Just War Theories
  • Lasers and Ray Guns
  • Less-lethal
  • Logistics
  • Los Alamos and Labs
  • M4 Monopoly
  • Medic!
  • Mercs
  • Missiles
  • Money Money Money
  • Most Wanted
  • MRAP Edge
  • Net-Centric
  • Nukes
  • Old Skool
  • Our Shrinking Planet
  • PEO Soldier
  • Planes, Copters, Blimps
  • Podcast
  • Politricks
  • Polmar's Perspective
  • Popular Mechanics
  • Rapid Fire
  • Raptor Watch
  • Red Team
  • Retro-Futuro
  • Robots
  • Roll Your Own
  • Sabra Tech
  • Ships and Subs
  • Snipertech
  • Soldier Systems
  • Space
  • Special Ops
  • Star Wars
  • Strategery
  • Stray Trons
  • Tactical Development
  • Terror Tech
  • The Deadlies
  • The Defense Biz
  • The Peoples' Site
  • The Sunday Paper
  • The Tanker Tango
  • The View from Av Week
  • Those Nutty Norks
  • Training and Sims
  • Trimble on the Case
  • Uncategorized
  • Video Lounge
  • War Update
  • Ward'z Wonderz
  • You can run…

Archives

  • November 2009
  • October 2009
  • September 2009
  • August 2009
  • July 2009
  • June 2009
  • May 2009
  • April 2009
  • March 2009
  • February 2009
  • January 2009
  • December 2008
  • November 2008
  • October 2008
  • September 2008
  • August 2008
  • July 2008
  • June 2008
  • May 2008
  • April 2008
  • March 2008
  • February 2008
  • January 2008
  • December 2007
  • November 2007
  • October 2007
  • September 2007
  • August 2007
  • July 2007
  • June 2007
  • May 2007
  • April 2007
  • March 2007
  • February 2007
  • January 2007
  • December 2006
  • November 2006
  • October 2006
  • September 2006
  • August 2006
  • July 2006
  • June 2006
  • May 2006
  • April 2006
  • March 2006
  • February 2006
  • January 2006
  • December 2005
  • November 2005
  • October 2005
  • September 2005
  • August 2005
  • July 2005
  • June 2005
  • May 2005
  • April 2005
  • March 2005
  • February 2005
  • January 2005
  • December 2004
  • November 2004
  • October 2004
  • September 2004
  • August 2004
  • July 2004
  • June 2004
  • May 2004
  • April 2004
  • March 2004
  • February 2004
  • January 2004
  • December 2003
  • November 2003
  • October 2003
  • September 2003
  • August 2003
  • July 2003
  • June 2003
  • May 2003
  • April 2003
  • March 2003
  • February 2003
  • January 2003

Home » Money Money Money » B-​​52s Axed for More Raptors

B-​​52s Axed for More Raptors

Air Force chiefs want their new stealth fight­ers, bad — so bad, they’re will­ing to scrap some of their best-​​performing planes early, in order to free up cash for their con­tro­ver­sial, next-​​generation jet.
raptor1.jpgInside Defense reports that “nearly half the B-​​52 bomber force and the full U-​​2 spy plane and F-​​117 stealth fighter fleets” will be retired ahead of sched­ule, under a Pentagon bud­get plan endorsed by the Air Force. It’s part of “a bid to save $16.4 $2.6 bil­lion and boost spend­ing” for the F-​​22 Raptor pro­gram.
About a year ago, a sim­i­lar Pentagon “Program Budget Decision,” or PBD, cut $10 bil­lion out of the F-22’s bud­get. Originally designed to duel with Soviet fight­ers, the Raptor seemed to be a plane with­out a mis­sion; the Air Force touted the F-​​22 as every­thing from a cargo lifter to an IED-​​stopper. A fleet of 277 Raptors was down­sized to 179 — despite a mas­sive PR cam­paign from the Air Force.
This PDB, Inside Defense notes, “would allow the Air Force to inject an addi­tional $1 bil­lion into its prized F-​​22A pro­gram,” and add a grand total of four planes to the Raptor roster.

Cuts to the long-​​range B-​​52 bomber fleet would reduce the inven­tory from 94 air­craft to 56… The Air Force is bank­ing on $4.6 bil­lion in sav­ings with this early retire­ment: $680 mil­lion in the pro­cure­ment accounts and $3.9 bil­lion in per­son­nel reduc­tions asso­ci­ated with a smaller B-​​52 fleet…
The Pentagon also plans to ter­mi­nate the B-​​52 Stand-​​off Jammer System, an elec­tronic attack capa­bil­ity, sav­ing $1.1 bil­lion across the five-​​year spend­ing plan, accord­ing to the PBD.

Convincing Congress to go along won’t be easy, however.

Similar attempts in recent years — includ­ing moves to stand down B-​​1B bombers, KC-​​135E aer­ial refu­el­ing air­craft, and the F-​​117 — have met stiff resis­tance on Capitol Hill. But this time around, the Pentagon appears to be tak­ing a new approach in propos­ing to retire three pro­grams at once.
Now theyre going for the whole enchi­lada, Christopher Bolkcom, an avi­a­tion expert at the Congressional Research Service, said. You can see that they seem to be launch­ing a frontal assault.

UPDATE 12:36 PM EST: “Privately, the Air Force sold the B-​​52 SOJ [stand-​​off jam­mer] on the mer­its of the very large anten­nas” that would jam the most dan­ger­ous enemy radar, Bolkcom tells Defense News. “If the B-​​52 is replaced with a smaller jam­ming plat­form, one may won­der how these fre­quen­cies will now be jammed, or whether the orig­i­nal argu­ment for the B-​​52 was valid.“
UPDATE 2:42 PM EST: “Remember, this is the same Air Force that tired every­thing it could to retire the A-​​10s early,” Murdoc reminds us. “What is it about these guys that dri­ves them to retire the most effec­tive planes in the inven­tory for expen­sive new fighters?”

Share |

January 10th, 2006 | Money Money Money, Planes, Copters, Blimps, Raptor Watch | 302344 Comments »http://defensetech.org/2006/01/10/b-52s-axed-for-more-raptors/B-52s+Axed+for+More+Raptors2006-01-10+14%3A05%3A37jason You can skip to the end and leave a response. Pinging is currently not allowed.

« « Rapid Fire 1/​09/​06 | “Yesterday’s Tomorrow, Today” » »

This website uses IntenseDebate comments, but they are not currently loaded because either your browser doesn't support JavaScript, or they didn't load fast enough.

  1. Me says:
    January 10, 2006 at 11:33 am

    Well, let’s face it, despite what con­gress thinks, trad­ing F-​​117s for F-​​22s does really make sense. The F-​​22 will have a sim­i­lar ground strike capa­bil­ity and lower RCS than the F-​​117, and that isn’t even its pri­mary mis­sion. Congressmen prone to nos­tal­gic attach­ments to exist­ing air­craft should not be allowed to vote.

    Reply
  2. Sean Woods says:
    January 10, 2006 at 1:00 pm

    Well, trad­ing the F-​​117 for the F-​​22 is a no brainer. The U-​​2, a unique air­craft, but most of what it does can be replaced by drones.
    But the B-​​52 is a com­pletely dif­fer­ent air­craft than the F-​​22. During the Iraq war we couldn’t keep enough in the air. When you need to drop a whole lot of ordi­nance on one point, you just can’t beat BUFF. It’s reli­able. It’s sturdy. It sure ain’t glam­orous, but it gets the job done.

    Reply
  3. TrustButVerify says:
    January 10, 2006 at 2:36 pm

    The F-​​22 may have a strike capa­bil­ity slightly bet­tern than the F-​​117, but surely we’re loos­ing ground when we give up the entire 49th Fighter Group (about 35 air­frames) for a gain of four F-​​22As.
    Can any­one dis­pute the fig­ures here? One F-​​22A demon­stra­bly does NOT have par­ity with eight F-​​117s when it comes to stealthy strike capa­bil­ity. Even giv­ing up stealth­i­ness by haul­ing ord­nance exter­nally, you’re still way behind.
    Don’t even bring up the B-​​52 tradeoffs.

    Reply
  4. gerald bailey jr. says:
    January 10, 2006 at 3:08 pm

    Axing the quan­tity of B-52’s as reported will be a deci­sion that the “stars” higher up will live to regret. The pay­load and reli­a­bil­ity of the warhorse is unmatched in todays “elec­tri­fied and com­put­er­fied” air force. They need to remem­ber their his­tory, or they are des­tined to relive it.

    Reply
  5. JSAllison says:
    January 10, 2006 at 4:18 pm

    “What is it about these guys that dri­ves them to retire the most effec­tive planes in the inven­tory for expen­sive new fight­ers?“
    You’re not really expect­ing an answer, are you?

    Reply
  6. Murc says:
    January 10, 2006 at 11:16 pm

    This doesn’t shock me any.
    The B-​​52 is very old, and its just keeps get­ting harder and harder to find replace­ment parts for it from bone yards.
    Besides…The B-​​1 is newer, faster, and can haul nearly twice its load.
    The U-​​2 should be retired because it no longer has a pur­pose to live, Any thing it can do the Global Hawk does better…and then some.
    And the F-​​117, despite hav­ing an “F” des­ig­na­tion, it isn’t a fighter…hell, its barely a bomber, and it can only hold two 2,000 pound bombs inter­nally and noth­ing exter­nally. It was a great air­craft, but its time for retire­ment has indeed come.

    Reply
  7. TrustButVerify says:
    January 11, 2006 at 8:56 am

    Murc,
    I just don’t see it. You’re going back­wards in strike capa­bil­ity for an unequal gain in A2A.
    Mind you, I think it’s impor­tant that we bring out next gen­er­a­tion fighter air­craft. This isn’t the way to do it. Here’s an idea: let’s cut every gen­eral officer’s pay 20%, and put for­ward a retroac­tive pay cut for all offi­cers, and cut all retiree pay by 50%. THAT’ll solve every­thing; we can even have a bake sale like in that stu­pid bumper sticker.

    Reply
  8. AirSix says:
    January 11, 2006 at 11:22 am

    They’ll have an inter­est­ing fight this time, though. Not only does the appro­pri­a­tion bill con­tain money for the B-​​52s and 117s, the autho­riza­tion con­fer­ence report expressly pro­hibits retire­ment of any 117s in FY06. So they can’t start until next year, by which time the fight will have been truly joined.

    Reply
  9. Byron Skinner says:
    January 11, 2006 at 3:01 pm

    Good Morning,
    May light­en­ing strike me down, I can’t find any­thing to dis­agree with Murc about. All his rea­sons for scrap­ping the air­craft in ques­tion seem to be valid.
    The only thing I can add is that Stealth as in the F-​​117 just doesn’t exist. That was shown dur­ing the Kosovo (I hate to call it a war) air exer­cise when an F-​​117 was shot down by the techon­lo­gly advanced Serbs. A coun­try that has put the M-​​98 Mauser in 7.92mm back into pro­duc­tion.
    Since cur­rently there are only 97 B-52’s and about 40 B-1B’s still on active fly­ing sta­tus I think the days of the large Strategic Bomber is more or less over.
    With the X-​​45 and X-47’s advanc­ing at the pace they are it would seem that the F-​​22 and the F-​​35 JSF (if it is ever built) will be the last manned Fighter/​Attack air­craft built.
    The A-​​1 Sky Raider got us into jets and these two air­craft will ground the heros.
    ALLONS,
    Byron Skinner

    Reply
  10. TrustButVerify says:
    January 11, 2006 at 4:34 pm

    Skinner,
    There’s no such thing as radar invis­i­bil­ity for air­craft. (Properly, it’s “low observ­abil­ity”, any­way.) I don’t know how much you know about the F-​​117 downed by the Serbs but the excel­lent Wonderland​.org​.nz site (presently down for rehost­ing so I can­not give you a direct link) cov­ered this sev­eral years ago. Without giv­ing a lec­ture on radar cross sec­tions and radar types, if the radar is close enough to the tar­get you’ll even­tu­ally get a strong enough return for a shoot­down. That NATO plan­ners had their strike pacakges using the same air cor­ri­dor every night. Eventually the Serbs wised up and got some SA-​​3s close enough to get a kill by a com­bi­na­tion of opti­cal cue­ing and luck. If the NATO air staffs hadn’t used the same cor­ri­dors every night this might never have hap­pened.
    So there you have it– that F-​​117 was killed more by com­pla­cent plan­ning than any­thing else.
    Your point about the new LO UCAVs is a good one, but I do not think we are well served by retir­ing the ol’ Goblin before we have a replace­ment on call.
    And four F-​​22As don’t carry any­thing like the wal­lop of a B-​​52 full of JDAMs. Or a B-​​1. I’d pre­fer the Buff for rea­sons of econ­omy.
    And be care­ful, the casual reader might mis­take your post as sup­port­ing the F-​​22!
    (Ah, the old A-​​1. I won­der if even the A-​​10 will ever live up to the legacy of that old warhorse… Breathtaking in sim­plic­ity and effec­tive­ness by any yard­stick. Wouldn’t want it near any kind of air defense, though.)

    Reply
  11. Trustbutverify says:
    January 13, 2006 at 12:16 pm

    Mr. Skinner–
    I cer­tainly agree that the X-​​47 (but not, it seems, the X-​​45) will give us a leg up in strike capa­bil­ity, as will the Raptor… When they’re avail­able in suf­fi­cient num­bers.
    No, sir, I don’t think stealth is dead yet. Not when you’re tak­ing on some­one with a mod­ern air defense. You might recall that F-​​117s dropped the first bombs of OIF.
    As to the UHF/​SHF backscat­ter detec­tion method I can say that I’m aware of it as a pro­to­type sys­tem but I don’t buy that this method was used by the Serbs. Can you pro­vide some ref­er­ences here?
    The Serbian air defense com­man­der was inter­viewed recently and none of the peri­od­i­cals which cov­ered it men­tioned this– they all men­tion cer­tain SA-​​3 tac­tics (opti­cal guid­ance, radar tweak­ing) and the con­stant re-​​use of the air cor­ri­dor as being key to the shoot­down. It was posted on Strategypage, pub­lished in some avi­a­tion jour­nals, and kicked around the mes­sage boards a bit so you shouldn’t have a prob­lem read­ing it your­self.
    As a final note I’d like to point out why in my opin­ion we need to retain some of the sys­tems for major the­ater war– North Korea, Iran, and China. And a low-​​observability strike capa­bil­ity just such a system.

    Reply
  12. Brian says:
    February 18, 2006 at 4:17 pm

    Axing the B-​​52s early may not be a bad move. They’re won­der­ful air­craft, but last I heard, cur­rent plans were to try and extend their lifes­pan out to the 2050s. At that point, the planes would be nearly a cen­tury old, older than the grand­par­ents of the pilots who would be fly­ing them. Cutting them now for more Raptors may be a way to ensure that we get a newer long range bomber. “Oops, no more B-​​52s. Guess we need a new bomber now.”

    Reply
  13. Brian says:
    March 13, 2006 at 4:35 pm

    What did I say, guys?
    http://​www​.mil​i​tary​.com/​f​e​a​t​u​r​e​s​/​0​,​1​5​2​4​0​,​9​0​6​3​6​,​0​0​.​h​tml
    The Air Force is look­ing to get a fly-​​away bomber before 2018. They aren’t can­celling the B-​​52 for noth­ing.
    All may bow down and wor­ship me now. Tell me you love me.

    Reply
  14. jerimiahuno says:
    March 24, 2006 at 7:44 pm

    Here we go again. None mil­i­tary politi­cians decid­ing to throw away mil­i­tary hard­ware that works so their fat cat busi­ness [lobists] can make mil­lions on a replace­ment that does not work. They retired the U-​​2/​SR-​​71 2 or 3 times already only to find they had to put them into servie again.

    Reply
  15. matt says:
    April 13, 2006 at 2:12 pm

    The B-​​52 is the work­horse of the bomber fleet. Our Jets are cur­rently unchal­lenged, and the B-​​52 along with the A-​​10 and C-​​130 are the main work­horses for the AF. We have already extended its longevity. We do need a new bomber pro­gram, but the B-​​1 should be cut.. it NEVER works, never launches, and is muu­u­uch more expen­sive to maintain.

    Reply
  16. Kevin McCune says:
    November 7, 2006 at 5:53 am

    I know its fic­tion, but talk to Dale Brown-​​Anyway the Raptor can sure help out every­thing else we put in the air.Navy please keep the Battleships-​​Kevin

    Reply
  17. Ryan says:
    June 6, 2007 at 10:37 pm

    We live in a sad age where rank-​​hungry incom­pe­tents will sell out not only our best hard­ware assets but per­son­nel as well. Sad indeed. That is why I have decided to seper­ate from the joke we call a mil­i­tary. I’m sick to my stom­ach at the lack of for­ti­tude, integrity, con­sti­tu­tion and over­all lead­er­ship. Shame on them.

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Click here to cancel reply.

Spam Protection by WP-SpamFree

By commenting on this topic you agree to the terms and conditions of our User Agreement

    Today's Hottest Topics
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
    • Pinnacle's New Armor
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
    • Marines Quiet About Brutal New Weapon
    Recent Comments
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
      I'm disappointed. When are they going to make clothes...
      Nadnerbus
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
      Part II : * USMC attempts to make a single seat (no...
      freefallingbomb
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
      Part I : I think we're not the only ones on the...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part III : Guided missiles will also be programmed to...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part II : If a tank shoots at another tank at only 5...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part I : To the poster "Will" : You wrote:...
      freefallingbomb
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
      Yeah, I don't get it. The "Dragon...
      Ptsfp
    • Pinnacle’s New Armor
      Should wikipedia Ned Kelly.He used armour that worked in...
      Nick
    • UPDATED: Details on Army’s New Afghanistan Duds
      Marines win agin hoo rur
      greg
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
      To the poster "batvette" : You wrote:...
      freefallingbomb
    Recent Articles
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
    • BAE to Market Mantis UAV to North America
    • Pinnacle’s New Armor
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
    • Northrop Invests Own Money In Fire Scout
    • IMINT: French Fashion Mavens Model MultiCam
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
    • Super Cavitation and the Truth
    • Mantis Begins Search For Prey
    Recent Hot Topics
    • Marines Quiet About Brutal New Weapon
    • The Osprey has Landed
    • UPDATED: Details on Army's New Afghanistan Duds
    • Iraq Cyber Attack and the DigiSEALs
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
    • Pinnacle's New Armor
    • (Proof) The Osprey Has Landed
    • Grim Wanat Footage
    • REPLACEMENT ARM, GOOD AS NEW
    • IMINT: French Fashion Mavens Model MultiCam
  • Channels: Military.com | Military Benefits | Military News | Off Duty | Join the Military | Military Education | Veteran Jobs | Military Money | Military Deals | Military Family | Military Community
  • Military.com Network: Military.com | MilBlogging | Defense Tech | DoD Buzz | SpouseBuzz | Fred's Place | GI Bill Express
  • Services: Army | Navy | Air Force | Marine Corps | Coast Guard | National Guard | Military Spouse
  • About Military.com About Us | Advertise With Us | Press | Affiliate Program | Monster Network | Help | Feedback | Privacy Policy | User Agreement | © 2009 Military Advantage