DefenseTech Military.com
  • Categories
  • Full Archives
  • Monthly Archives
  • About Defense Tech
Subscribe to RSS

About Defense Tech

Defense Tech exam­ines the inter­sec­tion of tech­nol­ogy and defense from every angle and pro­vides analy­sis on what’s ahead.

Tip Us Off

Tip for Defense Tech?

SEND IT!

It’s Confidential!

Categories

  • 'Canes
  • Afghan Update
  • Ammo and Munitions
  • Armor
  • Around the Globe
  • Av Week Extra
  • Axe in Iraq (and Elsewhere)
  • Bizarro
  • Blimps
  • Blog Bidness
  • Body Armor Blues
  • Bomb Squad
  • Brownshoes in Action
  • Bubbleheads, etc.
  • Cammo Green
  • Catch the "Buzz"
  • Chem-Bio
  • Civilian Apps
  • Cloak and Dagger
  • Commandos
  • Comms
  • Contingency Ops
  • Cops and Robbers
  • Cyber-warfare
  • Data Diving
  • Defense Tech Poll
  • Defense Tech Radio
  • Dissent Tech
  • Door Kickers
  • Drones
  • DT Administrivia
  • Eat DT's Dust
  • Extra! Extra!
  • Eye on China
  • Fast Movers
  • FCS Watch
  • Fire for Effect
  • FOS Files
  • Friday Funnies
  • Gadgets and Gear
  • Going Green
  • Grand Ole Osprey
  • Ground Vehicles
  • Guns
  • Homeland Security
  • In the Weeds with Eric
  • Info War
  • Iraq Diary
  • Jarhead Jazz
  • JSF Watch
  • Just War Theories
  • Lasers and Ray Guns
  • Less-lethal
  • Logistics
  • Los Alamos and Labs
  • M4 Monopoly
  • Medic!
  • Mercs
  • Missiles
  • Money Money Money
  • Most Wanted
  • MRAP Edge
  • Net-Centric
  • Nukes
  • Old Skool
  • Our Shrinking Planet
  • PEO Soldier
  • Planes, Copters, Blimps
  • Podcast
  • Politricks
  • Polmar's Perspective
  • Popular Mechanics
  • Rapid Fire
  • Raptor Watch
  • Red Team
  • Retro-Futuro
  • Robots
  • Roll Your Own
  • Sabra Tech
  • Ships and Subs
  • Snipertech
  • Soldier Systems
  • Space
  • Special Ops
  • Star Wars
  • Strategery
  • Stray Trons
  • Tactical Development
  • Terror Tech
  • The Deadlies
  • The Defense Biz
  • The Peoples' Site
  • The Sunday Paper
  • The Tanker Tango
  • The View from Av Week
  • Those Nutty Norks
  • Training and Sims
  • Trimble on the Case
  • Uncategorized
  • Video Lounge
  • War Update
  • Ward'z Wonderz
  • You can run…

Archives

  • November 2009
  • October 2009
  • September 2009
  • August 2009
  • July 2009
  • June 2009
  • May 2009
  • April 2009
  • March 2009
  • February 2009
  • January 2009
  • December 2008
  • November 2008
  • October 2008
  • September 2008
  • August 2008
  • July 2008
  • June 2008
  • May 2008
  • April 2008
  • March 2008
  • February 2008
  • January 2008
  • December 2007
  • November 2007
  • October 2007
  • September 2007
  • August 2007
  • July 2007
  • June 2007
  • May 2007
  • April 2007
  • March 2007
  • February 2007
  • January 2007
  • December 2006
  • November 2006
  • October 2006
  • September 2006
  • August 2006
  • July 2006
  • June 2006
  • May 2006
  • April 2006
  • March 2006
  • February 2006
  • January 2006
  • December 2005
  • November 2005
  • October 2005
  • September 2005
  • August 2005
  • July 2005
  • June 2005
  • May 2005
  • April 2005
  • March 2005
  • February 2005
  • January 2005
  • December 2004
  • November 2004
  • October 2004
  • September 2004
  • August 2004
  • July 2004
  • June 2004
  • May 2004
  • April 2004
  • March 2004
  • February 2004
  • January 2004
  • December 2003
  • November 2003
  • October 2003
  • September 2003
  • August 2003
  • July 2003
  • June 2003
  • May 2003
  • April 2003
  • March 2003
  • February 2003
  • January 2003

Home » Nukes » Britain’s new nuke debate

Britain’s new nuke debate

W76-W88.jpgThe con­ven­tional Trident may be dead, but nuclear Tridents have sparked a heated debate over the future of the UK’s nuclear weapons.
Submarine-​​launched Trident mis­siles have been Britain’s only nuclear option for almost a decade the UK never had inde­pen­dent ground-​​launch capa­bil­i­ties, and all the British air-​​delivered nuclear weapons were dis­man­tled by 1998. The mis­siles are built, main­tained, and ser­viced in the U.S., but Britain insists that it main­tains oper­a­tional inde­pen­dence.
Today, the British Tridents are based on four Vanguard-​​class sub­marines, which are aging and due to be decom­mis­sioned in the 2020s. Since the gov­ern­ment believes that new subs will take 17 years to design and build, a deci­sion needs to be made. If Britain does not build new subs, it will lose its inde­pen­dent nuclear deter­rent force.
Prime Minister Tony Blair’s gov­ern­ment could have made the deci­sion on its own, but opted instead to open the issue for debate and let Parliament decide a vote is sched­uled for March 2007.
Supporters of renew­ing the Trident say that 1) no other nuclear states are con­sid­er­ing elim­i­nat­ing their arse­nals, 2) the num­ber of nuclear states is increas­ing, 3) the world is a risky place, 4) it is impos­si­ble to pre­dict whether the Tridents will be needed, so it is bet­ter to retain them. These argu­ments together seem to say, essen­tially, that in an uncer­tain, dan­ger­ous world, it is bet­ter to have nukes than not (shhh don’t tell Iran!).
Opponents argue that the weapons are 1) unnec­es­sary (Britain’s role in the world no longer requires nukes), 2) inef­fec­tive (deter­rence is an “unproven the­ory” that is “essen­tially flawed,” espe­cially when it comes to ter­ror), 3) expen­sive (roughly 20 bil­lion that could be bet­ter spent else­where), 4) ille­gal (in vio­la­tion of Article VI of the Nonproliferation Treaty, which oblig­ates each sig­na­tory to work towards nuclear dis­ar­ma­ment), and 5) immoral.
The Scots have been par­tic­u­larly vir­u­lent in their crit­i­cisms this is par­tially tied up in British regional pol­i­tics but also stems from the fact that the Trident sub­marines’ only base is located in Scotland. Scottish offi­cials have drafted two provoca­tive but doomed-​​to-​​fail bills: one would crim­i­nal­ize “sup­port­ing the threat of the UKs nuclear deter­rent;” the other would charge the British gov­ern­ment 1 bil­lion (almost $2 bil­lion) for each nuclear war­head trans­ported through Scottish ter­ri­tory.
Churches and NGOs across the coun­try have voiced their oppo­si­tion, as well, and polls con­sis­tently show a major­ity of the British pub­lic opposed to Trident renewal. Blair has only offered minor con­ces­sions he “wants to” reduce the num­ber of subs and war­heads slightly but says the issue needs more study.
If the Trident debate remains binary renewal vs. no renewal Blair has more than enough votes to push his pro­posal through Parliament. There may be a third option, though: delay the deci­sion. U.S. nuclear experts Dick Garwin, Philip E. Coyle (dis­clo­sure: my boss), Theodore A. Postol, and Frank von Hippel recently argued that the Vanguard subs can last up to 15 years longer than the gov­ern­ment said, with refur­bish­ments and light use. They argue that putting the deci­sion off would be the best way to main­tain “a vari­ety of options.” It is unclear whether the gov­ern­ment is inter­ested in this option, but over 100 MPs (out of 646) have called for the deci­sion to be delayed.
This will be a debate to watch if the dis­ar­ma­ment advo­cates suc­ceed, Britain may become the first of the big five nuclear pow­ers to give up its weapons. It looks unlikely in the near future, though.
– Eric Hundman

Share |

February 16th, 2007 | Nukes | 349511 Comments »http://defensetech.org/2007/02/16/britains-new-nuke-debate/Britain%27s+new+nuke+debate2007-02-16+15%3A01%3A32sharon_weinberger You can skip to the end and leave a response. Pinging is currently not allowed.

« « Researching Tomorrow’s Chem-​​Bio Defense | Navy Grows Land Forces » »

This website uses IntenseDebate comments, but they are not currently loaded because either your browser doesn't support JavaScript, or they didn't load fast enough.

  1. Byron Skinner says:
    February 16, 2007 at 12:47 pm

    Good Morning Folks,
    Like Putin’s Russia the United Kingdom is falling off the sec­ond tier of Nations. Neither coun­try can afford to sup­port the Nuclear Option and for both it time to face real­ity.
    ALLONS,
    Byron Skinner

    Reply
  2. Tom Chiverton says:
    February 16, 2007 at 3:15 pm

    As a Brit, I agree — our hos­pi­tals and pub­lic trans­port sys­tems are falling apart, we don’t have the money to waste on hyp­o­crit­i­cal ‘we need them to be safe’ weapons.
    Disclaimer: http://​www​.rachae​land​tom​.info/​g​a​l​l​e​r​y​/​m​a​i​n​.​p​h​p​?​g​2​_​v​i​e​w​=​c​o​r​e​.​D​o​w​n​l​o​a​d​I​t​e​m​&​a​m​p​;​g​2​_​i​t​e​m​I​d​=​1​0​1​6​4​&​a​m​p​;​g​2​_​s​e​r​i​a​l​N​u​m​b​e​r=2

    Reply
  3. sam says:
    February 16, 2007 at 6:15 pm

    “As a Brit, I agree — our hos­pi­tals and pub­lic trans­port sys­tems are falling apart, we don’t have the money to waste on hyp­o­crit­i­cal ‘we need them to be safe’ weapons.“
    Well, you guys will likely be part of the European Islamic Republic one day-​​so if you want to give up the nukes now-that’s fine.

    Reply
  4. BT says:
    February 16, 2007 at 7:37 pm

    The ‘guns ver­sus but­ter’ argu­ment in not valid for nuclear deter­ence. The UK must decide if they need oper­a­tional nuclear weapons or not. My guess, unless there is some sort of EU secu­rity col­lec­tive, they will decide not to renew their nuclear weapons, and become like Japan. They will remain under the US nuclear umbrella. In 20 years, that will leave the US, Russia, China, India, Pakistan, France, Israel, and Iran with active nuclear weapons.
    Notice I left out DPRK, and included Iran, those two coun­tries have dif­fer­ent fates in the next 20 years. DPRK will not exist, and Iran will be the Persian Hegemon and be a counter to Israel.

    Reply
  5. David Hambling says:
    February 17, 2007 at 6:55 am

    It’s not about money per se — the

    Reply
  6. Macaca says:
    February 18, 2007 at 8:22 am

    I dont think its a good idea to lis­ten too much to nor­mal medium/​lower tier civil­ian admin­is­tra­tors and the pub­lic in gen­eral in global secu­rity issues like this. They sim­ply dont have the back­ground knowl­edge and world­view needed to assess top­ics like this.
    This nuke issue one of those things you dont want to mess up. A prob­lem is the mag­ni­tude of the mat­ter (mega-​​ton explo­sions) in com­bi­na­tion with the ‘rogue state’ thing. You sim­ply can­not be sure.
    But in the nor­mal pol­i­tics any inse­cu­rity will be exploited by ones oppo­nents, because of any con­flict will be mag­ni­fied and polar­ized. Which is stu­pid enough in nor­mal pol­i­tics, but heh, that democ­racy for you. But the trend in democ­racy is that its a free-​​for-​​all mixed tag team mad­ness: and it’s so easy to score from the anti-​​nuke posi­tion (and very easy to burn your­self when pro-​​nuke), so dont expected a proper solu­tion, but a some­what gimped com­pro­mise that will A: costs lots of money any­way, and B: wont prop­erly do its job.
    Maybe ask the pub­lic a ques­tion: do you want the mil­i­tary to pro­tect our econ­omy and our livestyle? If yes: give a bud­get and let usfix things. If not: then its every­body for him­self: start dig­ging bunkers and learn­ing Arabic.

    Reply
  7. Byron Skinner says:
    February 18, 2007 at 2:14 pm

    Good Morning Folks,
    One point that I think that has been missed in this dicus­sion is that the U.K. doesn’t pro­duce it’s nuclear weapons be it SLICBM’s, Tomahawks, or enen Mark 48’s. They are depen­dant on the United States for there nuclear capa­bil­i­ties.
    The unasked ques­tion is, is this where the U.K. really wants to be?
    Can the U.S. be relied on, will the Americans alway be on the side of the best inter­ests of the U.K. I doubt that any cit­i­zen of the U.K. can hon­estly say yes to either of these ques­tions.
    If the above is true then the only option that would be accept­able to the U. K. would be a nuclear force that is Independent of Washington and fick­led American vot­ers who could in any Presidental Election elect a Neo-​​Calvinist President who firmly beleave that the U.K. is in the bow­els of Satin and it’s destruc­tion would be a bless­ing to all Christians.
    ALLONS,
    Byron Skinner

    Reply
  8. Murc says:
    February 19, 2007 at 11:35 pm

    “(shhh

    Reply
  9. elizzar says:
    February 20, 2007 at 6:02 am

    Hi all.
    A few points. Firstly there has been some seri­ous uk gov­ern­ment invest­ment (>

    Reply
  10. Brycey says:
    February 15, 2008 at 9:46 am

    …I can­not believe what i’ve just read… all you who think that get­ting rid of our nukes is a good idea, are all com­pletely igno­rant! Lets say Iran or Libya gets hold of nukes, do you really think that they are not going to fire on us just because we’ve dis­man­tled ours??? Get a Grip! but if they did get a hold of some and we DO have nukes, they might think twice about launch­ing them if they know that they are going to get nuked too! Don’t ya think?!

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Click here to cancel reply.

Spam Protection by WP-SpamFree

By commenting on this topic you agree to the terms and conditions of our User Agreement

    Today's Hottest Topics
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
    • Pinnacle's New Armor
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
    • Marines Quiet About Brutal New Weapon
    • UPDATED: Details on Army's New Afghanistan Duds
    Recent Comments
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
      They are going to have to look at the whole...
      Wembley
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
      Just look at this " picture " for a moment. The...
      Zandor
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      I know LOSAT seemed awesome but wasn't it cancelled? I...
      JimboJones
    • BAE to Market Mantis UAV to North America
      Yes you're quite right, I get to witness...
      JimboJones
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
      I'm disappointed. When are they going to make clothes...
      Nadnerbus
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
      Part II : * USMC attempts to make a single seat (no...
      freefallingbomb
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
      Part I : I think we're not the only ones on the...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part III : Guided missiles will also be programmed to...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part II : If a tank shoots at another tank at only 5...
      freefallingbomb
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
      Part I : To the poster "Will" : You wrote:...
      freefallingbomb
    Recent Articles
    • Army Launches Examination of Armor Testing
    • New Camo Pattern on the Block
    • BAE to Market Mantis UAV to North America
    • Pinnacle’s New Armor
    • Zapping Drones from a Truck
    • Northrop Invests Own Money In Fire Scout
    • IMINT: French Fashion Mavens Model MultiCam
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
    • Super Cavitation and the Truth
    • Mantis Begins Search For Prey
    Recent Hot Topics
    • Marines Quiet About Brutal New Weapon
    • The Osprey has Landed
    • UPDATED: Details on Army's New Afghanistan Duds
    • VTOL JSF Arrives at Pax River
    • Iraq Cyber Attack and the DigiSEALs
    • Pinnacle's New Armor
    • (Proof) The Osprey Has Landed
    • Grim Wanat Footage
    • REPLACEMENT ARM, GOOD AS NEW
    • IMINT: French Fashion Mavens Model MultiCam
  • Channels: Military.com | Military Benefits | Military News | Off Duty | Join the Military | Military Education | Veteran Jobs | Military Money | Military Deals | Military Family | Military Community
  • Military.com Network: Military.com | MilBlogging | Defense Tech | DoD Buzz | SpouseBuzz | Fred's Place | GI Bill Express
  • Services: Army | Navy | Air Force | Marine Corps | Coast Guard | National Guard | Military Spouse
  • About Military.com About Us | Advertise With Us | Press | Affiliate Program | Monster Network | Help | Feedback | Privacy Policy | User Agreement | © 2009 Military Advantage