So, a few months ago you might remember we talked about a series of tests of Boeing’s airborne laser — a massive, Rube Goldberg contraption housed in a 747 freighter aimed at knocking down ballistic missiles.
During a phoner press conference, Boeing officials mentioned in passing they were working on another system that could engage ground targets. To me, this seems far more logical for such a weapon than one that’s designed to knock out missiles…that mission strikes me as redundant.
Well, now it seems Boeing has taken the first step in making the laser gunship a reality by installing the weapon on a C-130H…
Boeing completed the laser installation Dec. 4 at Kirtland Air Force Base, N.M. The laser, including its major subsystem, a 12,000-pound integrated laser module, was moved into place aboard the aircraft and aligned with the previously-installed beam control system, which will direct the laser beam to its target.
With the laser installed, Boeing is set to conduct a series of tests leading up to a demonstration in 2008 in which the program will fire the laser in-flight at mission-representative ground targets to demonstrate the military utility of high-energy lasers. The test team will fire the laser through a rotating turret that extends through the aircraft’s belly.
“The installation of the high-energy laser shows that the ATL program continues to make tremendous progress toward giving the warfighter a speed-of-light, precision engagement capability that will dramatically reduce collateral damage,” said Scott Fancher, vice president and general manager of Boeing Missile Defense Systems.
“Next year, we will fire the laser at ground targets, demonstrating the military utility of this transformational directed energy weapon.“
I just love the idea that a JTAC could soon call in for a laser strike on a target. Move over Spectre, say hello to the new “Vulcan” cannon (Star Trek reference here).
ATL, which Boeing is developing for the U.S. Department of Defense, will destroy, damage or disable targets with little to no collateral damage, supporting missions on the battlefield and in urban operations. Boeing’s Advanced Tactical Laser industry team includes L-3 Communications/Brashear, which made the laser turret, and HYTEC, Inc., which made various structural elements of the weapon system.
Can’t wait to see the test shoot next year…
– Christian
{ 73 comments… read them below or add one }
The ABL does make a grand ASAT platform, don’t you think? Even if its boost phase mission is usurped it still could intimidate any that want to take a shot at our birds in space.
As a fan of Keith Laumer’s BOLO sci-fi novels featuring self-aware tanks, it will be both interesting and ironic to see if directed energy weapons spell the demise of airborne weapon systems on the future battlefield.
Energy weapons could negate incoming missile and artillery fire, and any aircraft approaching within line-of-sight to engage with an energy weapon could be destroyed by heavier armed and armored ground units.
Anyone for a fusion-powered 15,000 ton tank?
Would this be the L3Comm that they are trying to merge with the Chinese government owned company?
This would be very useful if they could use this to clear routes of IED. I remember reading somethig about a General asking if industry could come up with something to mount on a HUMVEE, using laser to cut wires etc.
Yes,but can it stop asteroids dead in their tracks that would cause extinction-level events that would threaten ALL mankind(& womankind & animal kind & plant kind & fish kind too)? AND could it penetrate space aliens’ force fields if they try to conquer us like in the TV show “V” or the movie “Independence Day?” Another gripe at the Air Force,they sure have been doing a lousy job protecting the Stargate.No wonder they closed down the Cheyenne Mountain Complex.
I wonder how the engagement will happen… can you request an intensity level: Med, Well, Crispy, or Crunchy? And if you used a laser designator with it, I guess it becomes be a Laser Guided Laser (LGL) then.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmFag3hiu70
>This would be very useful if they could use this to clear routes of IED.
Only if it is near the surface where the heat could self detonate the IED. Electro-optical frequencies do not have good penetration characteristics as electro-magentic radio frequencies. I would propose “MASERS” for that use.
Only a REAL GENIUS could come up with something like this.
“All I want is freaking sharks with LASER BEAMS”
Now we can clear mines alot faster not mentioning locating them easier!
Now we can clear mines easier and safer!!
Wait, anti-ballistic missile capbility is redundant, but air-to-ground destruction isn’t?
Think about how many systems can destroy a ballisitc missile in it’s boost phase. Now think about how many systems can destroy a target from the air. I don’t think we need another of the latter as much as one of the former
This would make an excellent addition to the AC-130 Gunship’s weapons system.
One interesting thing about this is that you could bring down an aircraft before the target’s pilot realized he was being targeted. Think 6.2usec/mile and 100 miles would be only .62msec (pretty fast for most humans to respond to). I suspect that manned aircraft face many issues when they begin using these lasers in a dog fight. We may be witnesses to the beginning of the end of close in air to air combat.
I’m a little confused about this weapon’s utility. It sounds like it’s packing the energy content of a welding torch into a 2 ton flying maglight.
How are you supposed to kill terrorists with this? Hold the beam on him long enough until he fries? Wouldn’t that be kind of difficult/cruel?
I guess you could clear mines like mentioned earlier, or cut wires, but are there really enough situations where this will be useful?
I’m all for laser guns, but it doesn’t sound like they have quite enough energy output yet.
Two of my favorite words. Phasers . . . Fire!
As I recall, they work on almost anything.
It’s kind like when I was eight, sitting in the back yard on a sunny Saturday killing ants with a magnifying glass. The pilot will have to be an only child.
Screw the fusion tank, with stuff like this, it’s time the U.S. military invests in fusion-powered mech warriors.
Specs:
At least eight-stories high, walks on two feet
SPY-1 radar, 360-degree coverage
Non-lethal microwave crowd-dispersal device
Non-lethal acoustic crowd-disperal device
Lethal high-energy laser
Automatic grenade launcher
Two, hellfire missile pods (4 missiles per pod)
MLRS backpack
Belt-fed M-60 (liquid nitrogen cooled)
…and a giant flame-thrower (for effect)
Hiya folks. Excimer is a UV laser, capable of extremely narrow beam widths because they operate below 390 nanometres wavelengths.
A CO2 (carbon dioxide) laser is the sort used for cutting steel slab and has an operating wavelength of 10.6 microns (infra red). A Yag (yttrium aluminum garnet) laser such as is used for treating eye problems, or as a range finder, operates at 1.064 microns in the NIR (near infra red. Things like HeNe’s operate in the visible. I don’t know what the eggheads have got in mind, but I’d go for the CO2 if we can find a way to diminish atmospheric absorbtion.
is funny how I remembre playig asteroid in the arcade for noe defence it should be play now for nasa i wonder waht can be done with the mercury.probably not go any where with out getting canser.ha!
The popcorn scene was clearly awesome.
psst!!! beat me up snotty!!! i’ll just pull out a mirror and reflect the beam back to the plane, problem solved.
sounds pretty cool. WAY better than the 747.
just pray that one of these things never crashes! that would be a pretty big mess. i say stay away from chemical lasers.
Oh great! Another rat hole to throw taxpayer money down. Very little of what these guys make actually works. It is al about ripping off the government treasury.
Brian – The “real genius” reference was just awesome.
>i’ll just pull out a mirror and reflect the beam back to the plane, problem solved.<
I don’t think a mirror on a vehicle would be an effective defense against lasers by reflecting the beam back to, and destroying, the plane or weapon. First, the mirror would have to be scrupulously clean, otherwise the beam would be diffused, or the mirror destroyed. As anyone who has served in the field knows, everything gets covered in dirt in tactical operations. So this rules out covering an entire vehicle with mirrored surfaces. This would mean a mirror placed behind a protective cover, that could be moved into the path of the laser, aimed, and uncovered at the right moment. But how would you be able to place a mirror in the right location on the vehicle and tilt to the correct angle to hit a moving target, before a beam traveling at the speed of light could disable the vehicle? Doesn’t sound feasible to me.
I think this is retarded and a waste of money. The airborne laser is much more practical then this. Airborne laser is suited for shooting down missiles, this thing is impractical. Here is why.
1. Its a huge flying tank of volatile chemicals. One heavy round through the plane has the potential to make it explode or catch fire. This makes it a bad close air support weapon when enemy is around.
2. The laser is not that strong.
3. It is expensive.
Basically being so vulnerable, and with more effective aircraft out their like the specter, this is just a waste of money.
BTW, I love the specter and support the airborne laser.
Imagine the psychological effects of a group of terrorists getting ready to deploy when suddenly one of them bursts into flames and vaporizes. Silent, without a terrestrial line of sight and basically invisible. So there is a plane many miles away, that would be the last consideration.
Because we are dealing with an enemy that is by and large ignorant, primitive and superstitious a sudden death by flash fry would have a significant effect.
I agree that we are probably seeing the last days of close air combat but then again the air force jockeys days were numbered with the successful use of ground controlled aircraft.
Now perhaps they could use them to torch the ‘elusive as Osama’ opium fields that are supporting the terrorists (both domestic and foreign)
How the hell are you going to get a 12,000 lb laser on a friken shark’s head?1?!!?
Ah, yes. The demo next year will target nonmoving items on the ground. In recent years we have selected the wrong targets in various countries and killed civilians including children. Now our efficient military will be able to select the incorrect targets and kill innocent people in a more spectacular manner. – - – How about correcting our error-ridden target-selection process first?
Does anybody have a price tag on this?
The really key question is whether it is cheaper or more expensive than the alternatives that can do the same things (e.g. small laser guided air to ground missiles designed to do the same thing from a fighter platform that is a cheaper aircraft to buy).
What do you think a phase conjugate tracking system is for? A big laser needs a big mirror, Kent.
Ah yes, everybody’s an expert.
Especially those having absolutely no knowledge about the subject matter.
If it saves 1 American life, I’m for it.
Although I’m not an expert on the physics of vehicle-mounted laser generation, I know a thing or two about the ablative properties of water and human tissues. The energy required to inflict a mobility kill (subject cannot maneuver) on a vehicle is comparable to the amount of energy required to kill one human with a laser. Water in organic tissue vaporizes easily, carrying away the energy at the contact site and scattering some of the incoming beam. Killing people and animals with a laser is a longer process than Star Trek would have us believe. The same laser can heat-stress and warp the moving parts in a motive drive (tracked, wheeled, whatever), rendering an armored transport or a tank immobile until repairs can be made. As a preparatory strike before conventional weapons are brought to bear, it’s wonderfully efficient. As a surgical anti-personnel weapon, it’s not.
Did it say they were using it to target people? NO.
This kind of thing would be used to destroy ground targets like radar/missle sites, not to fry someone standing around pickin’ their nose.
Seriously, some of these comments must have been made by the terminally brain damaged….
For starters who even mentioned that this would be a COIL? At 12,000 lbs it isn’t big enough to be a COIL. I suspect that it is a Fiber Optic Laser for both the small size and the fact that it is going to be mounted on a C130. You don’t need to vaporise a target in order to disable it. A melted engine block means you won’t be going anywhere. Same thing with a fire in an ammunition dump. Zap a pile of RPG rounds and you get a lot of excitement. A beam diameter of 2-3 inches is more than enough to cause serious damage.
Regarding superstitious peoples, this weapon would frighten people just because it would appear to come from nowhere (even twenty miles away).
I’m all for the development of weapons like this. It’s true that we’re nowhere near REAL GENIUS–sadly, no one has brought in Val Kilmer to do the heavy lifting on this research. Or that guy in the closet. We aren’t going to find a laser that will vaporize enemy infantry or tanks in our arsenal anytime soon. What we may have, however, is a weapon that can ignite fuel tanks, set off munitions, or disable vehicles in a crowded area. It will undoubtedly cost more money per shot than simply firing from a Specter gunship, at least for the next few years, anyway. As the weapon currently exists, it is probably inferior in most respects to those currently available. The only advantage I can see is the ability to strike a hostile vehicle surrounded by civilian targets (something you can’t do with the Specter). The real advantage with this weapon is where it is 10-15 years from today. Remember, at one point, crossbows were superior to muskets.
I am all for research and development; and I understand the need for weapons with less collateral damage; But it seems like a lot of money is going to spent to do something an guided 500 pound bomb, that can be carried by anything flying, can do.
If this is developed the only people who will be using it is the CIA and the Israelis…..
And I think the CIA is to stupid to have such a toy.
lots of money for little or no effect. Don’t get me wrong I like the idea of lazer weapons (if we can put them on Sharks heads I am totally there). But a the cost per shot it is going to take to fire a chem lazer of that size is just not worth it.
We need to start thinking about the fact that we can’t afford to continue to have this $650 billion defence budget anymore and start thinking about what is just a ltitle over the top.
As with any new weapon it will take time to perfect. The more work done on it , the smaller it will be and the more power it will have. A 500lbs. bomb might be better now but how many times can you you use that 500lbs. Bomb ? Some of you sound like the chief of ordnance during the civil war. He didn’t want repeating rifle’s because they used too much ammunition.
As with any new weapon it will take time to perfect. The more work done on it , the smaller it will be and the more power it will have. A 500lbs. bomb might be better now but how many times can you you use that 500lbs. Bomb ? Some of you sound like the chief of ordnance during the civil war. He didn’t want repeating rifle’s because they used too much ammunition.
I’m more interested/concerned by the main side effect: blindness among bystanders. Even the current targeting lasers can blind people quite easily; if this bigger laser hits something somewhat reflective (such as a car fender with the paint boiled off), anyone looking generally in that direction might be instantly, permanently blinded (unless they’re wearing goggles to filter out the laser radiation, or stop any high-powered flash in general). The “Stingray” system, from 10 years ago or so, was pretty much stopped due to this issue.
I don’t think they’ll be instantly blinded, but over the course of a few hours people will start seeing dark spots in their eyes. Infra red lasers are notorious for doing permanent eye damage without people realizing it’s happening. Vision is lost over the course of a day or so but might be salvageable with timely medical intervention.
If you have a vehicle suddenly starting to melt, that might attract a lot of attention, exacerbating the problem.
ABL is a “Rube Goldberg” device? Not at all biased are we? But thats not on topic.
The C-130 (C-130ABL?) will be a great weapon in support of ground troops. It will surgically take out weapons, people, and vehicles. Unlike an AC-130′s guns, it will do so with little indication of where the laser “blast” originated from. It will do so perfectly quietly – except for the noise from it’s turboprops. Insurgents might not even hear their comrade die and thus not be alerted to run. It could kill an Iraqi insurgent even as he’s standing in the doorway of a mosque and maybe (…) even in the interior courtyard – something you wouldn’t dare try with explosives. It will truely be “silent death” incarnate. If it can do this from 20,000ft – it will be even better (I’ll be interested in seeing what the final range it).
Not mentioned is that this system may be able to also take out local theatre incoming cruise and short-range missiles, hostile UAV’s, fixed and rotary aircraft, and perhaps as it evolves even SAM’s and AAM.
Get this thing in the air and watch its missions grow. This thing may be far more useful than the 747 ABL – its easier to deploy, durable, and less expensive to operate.
Wish they could get the weight of the laser down just a bit and put it on a V-22. It could deploy to the front lines and fly defensive patrol without ever leaving.
It will truely be “silent death” incarnate.
________________________________________________
I don’t see how you could burn someone to death with a 4 inch blow torch and not expect him to scream.
could we use it to blow up alderaan
I just betcha that this thing would be good for making popcorn on movie night. It would probably also be good at interior decorating as well.
Can we also give this to law enforcement, security guards, bodyguards and private investigators. We can replace Tasers with this technology. It is for our own security and protection.
If this weapon can accidently blind civilians, then it is not a “surgical” weapon and is probably not suitable for counterinsurgency warfare.
Looks like it is a COIL.
http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/22975
This version makes a lot more sense doctrinally than the ABL. The ABL is a wonderful piece of equipment, if not horrifically expensive. Unfortunately it
When’s this thing going to be available for air-to-air combat?
P.S. EVIL!
I see several posts about this and the ABL being useless. I disagree. These are the future. Those enemies who can afford them will develop them as well – thats the nature of weapons. “if we don’t they will”. At any rate, both of these systems, with their somewhat limited ranges are theatre weapons.
Both will be deployed with hostile intent, or the threat of hostile intent, whenever and whenever tensions are high. But they’re no more and provocative than say cruise or other missiles including ABM’s – like say a PAC3, especially one on an F-15. But for many types of attacks they will be much more effective, and actually considerably less provocative than explosives.
As to those concerned about accidently blinding civilians – of course that will happen. Innocents will always be injured in conflict. But as a civilian in an insurgency zone would you rather take your chances with the accidential reflections of a laser off your highly polished Mercedes or would you rather be in the vicinity of a highly accurate ATACMS, a small Viper Strike, or a burst of 30mm rounds from an AC-130?
The trouble with the ATL as a low collateral damage weapon is that you can be 100-500 meters away from a laser strike and probably still suffer significant vision damage. I don’t think you can say that about weapons like viper strike.
@people who say that ABL is useless
That’s just nonsense. The ABL is our best shot at boost phase interception, period. As for justifiable cause, etc etc. First of all, no one will care. Second of all, the NK are not crazy enough to start a war because No Dong 5 has been shot down. Lastly, they are not stupid enough to start a war after their only means at striking US and allies have just been defeated.
Another problem is if the weapon is accidently fired towards the horizon instead of the ground. My knowledge of laser physics is very small, but I think the beam would defocus and scatter, spreading over a fairly wide area and potentially causing vision loss for people several kilometers away. Humans are so reliant on their eyesight that the thought of partial or complete blindness is a source of unique horror for most people.
This could become, like napalm, a serious blot on America’s reputation.
Don’t get all excited. This is an early test model. In time all your concerns will be addressed and it will be the preferred weapon
Sleep well. Just do your job.
Mr. Scott: it is as if I had written it myself but to not let these idiots teach their “rot” would be far worse. There would be no comparative thought, which is necessary to be educated. That is why the dems wanted the 18-year old voting act: the younger, the more one can be molded to liberalism, or any “ism” for that matter.
‘Because we are dealing with an enemy that is by and large ignorant, primitive and superstitious a sudden death by flash fry would have a significant effect.’
that is so true.
remember towers?
What if, what if, what if? The US would never us this if not already at war as the congress wouldn’t let them period. It is like the nuke, who many have been used since 1945?
What if, what if, what if? The US would never us this if not already at war as the congress wouldn’t let them period. It is like the nuke, who many have been used since 1945?
It will never be deployed. The lawyers running the Army set up the rules of engagement; you must stop them and ask them to surrender, if they don’t, you hit them with a marshmellow and detain them in our local Holiday Inn.
Let’s give the technology to the Japanese. They always figure out how to build things smaller, quickly. Then take the miniature version and mount them on remote control planes. Fly about 50,000 of them through the mountains of Afghanistan and eliminate anything that doesn’t belong there. Snap, crackle, POP!
Let’s give the technology to the Japanese. They always figure out how to build things smaller, quickly. Then take the miniature version and mount them on remote control planes. Fly about 50,000 of them through the mountains of Afghanistan and eliminate anything that doesn’t belong there. Snap, crackle, POP!
I just want to see a large a spaceship called enterprise, lol. What are we going to do when the enemy shots one down and acquires the technology? We need more technology war machines like this, but technology and economy plays hand and hand so we have to sit on the more amazing stuff we have.
If we had a real world war againthe government would release the higher technologies they have been sitting on for over 40 years, would be nice.
Heart of War
Shawn Earnest
Sun Tzu.
I wonder if it is anything like the 400 Terra Joule (400,000,000,000,000 Joules (Watts / second) chemical laser that I attended the course for back in 1977 – this had to use a ‘pre-cursor’ laser to part the air molecules so that the main laser didn’t turn the air to plasma trying to fight it’s way through.
I just thing that this is a fantasy of officials. If not, it is far more worse – what would happen to the rest of weapons, If the US Army converts to laser? I tell you what. They will distribute them for affordable prices to Muslim and African countries, so they could carry on their ‘monkey tribes’ wars.
They had laser cannons in airplanes, jeeps and ships for over thirty years. Reagan gave the technology to the reds when he announced his so-called “star wars” program to prevent a first strike by them. I have no doubt that our “government by crooks” will use the technology for “assassinations from space” IE “spontaneous combustion’s” to control the masses. Our secret laser missile shield has been operational for years.
It is being made public so they can start selling these systems, more than likely to the Arabs. Pretty soon Mohammad will be the only one with enough money to buy them.
Some of these systems are capable of hundereds of pulses a second. I read a report in the seventies where a military test only knocked out 4 targets in a second. They were trying for a lot more. It is more than likely that the military has a secret orbiting laser and smart bomb cannons on a platform in space, opperational for years. .
“Monkey Tribe” Wars? what an ignorant twit Elen Prague is….
the americans are masters when it comes to building all types of terrible weapons that they can use to steal the wealth of other countries in the name of demoncracy.then they tell the innocent SHEEP of the world, that they protect and advance demoncracy.the americans and the brits are the lakeys of the money power the HOGGENHEIMERS.they gave all of africa demoncracy now the monkey tribes are destroying themselves. the most lethal weapon of mass destrion and suffering ,is demoncracy they will think up all shit to blind the SHEEP of the world,, to prevent them from seeing WHAT’S REALY GOING ON!!!!
I can’t believe they finally got it to work. This is cool.
The technology is so intense… pretty much impossible for the freaks to steal it.
OR we could spend the money on international events, education upgrades to understand eachother and lets have peace instead??
I own 2 rifles but use them for sport. I don’t believe in war.
They don’t have to think of what to tell the sheep
they just mind control them. They don’t have to work that hard.