Those air conditioned trailers, the long nights of work in a comfortable chair, sleeping in my own bed after duty, being so close to Las Vegas!…Whatever…
Just when you thought it couldn’t get any more pathetic, something like this pops up:
Predator Pilots Suffering War Stress
MARCH AIR RESERVE BASE, Calif. — The Air National Guardsmen who operate Predator drones over Iraq via remote control, launching deadly missile attacks from the safety of Southern California 7,000 miles away, are suffering some of the same psychological stresses as their comrades on the battlefield.
Working in air-conditioned trailers, Predator pilots observe the field of battle through a bank of video screens and kill enemy fighters with a few computer keystrokes. Then, after their shifts are over, they get to drive home and sleep in their own beds.
But that whiplash transition is taking a toll on some of them mentally, and so is the way the unmanned aircraft’s cameras enable them to see people getting killed in high-resolution detail, some officers say.
In a fighter jet, “when you come in at 500–600 mph, drop a 500-pound bomb and then fly away, you don’t see what happens,” said Col. Albert K. Aimar, who is commander of the 163rd Reconnaissance Wing here and has a bachelor’s degree in psychology. But when a Predator fires a missile, “you watch it all the way to impact, and I mean it’s very vivid, it’s right there and personal. So it does stay in people’s minds for a long time.“
Now, far be it for me to pass judgement on some of these pilots who feel the stresses of their unique job, but let’s hope this isn’t just another shot at “relevance” by an Air Force that feels sidelined by two major ground wars in the Middle East.
In interviews with five of the dozens of pilots and sensor operators at the various bases, none said they had been particularly troubled by their mission, but they acknowledged it comes with unique challenges, and sometimes makes for a strange existence.
“It’s bizarre, I guess,” said Lt. Col. Michael Lenahan, a Predator pilot and operations director for the 196th Reconnaissance Squadron here. “It is quite different, going from potentially shooting a missile, then going to your kid’s soccer game.”
Among the stresses cited by the operators and their commanders: the exhaustion that comes with the shift work of this 24–7 assignment; the classified nature of the job that demands silence at the breakfast table; and the images transmitted via video.
A Predator’s cameras are powerful enough to allow an operator to distinguish between a man and a woman, and between different weapons on the ground. While the resolution is generally not high enough to make out faces, it is sharp, commanders say.
Often, the military also directs Predators to linger over a target after an attack so that the damage can be assessed.
“You do stick around and see the aftermath of what you did, and that does personalize the fight,” said Col. Chris Chambliss, commander of the active-duty 432nd Wing at Creech Air Force Base, Nev. “You have a pretty good optical picture of the individuals on the ground. The images can be pretty graphic, pretty vivid, and those are the things we try to offset. We know that some folks have, in some cases, problems.“
I wonder how embarrassed these pilots are gonna be when they see their quotes used for this kind of story because I guarantee the reporter didn’t have this lede in mind when he went into it.
And here’s what those “stressed out” Reaper pilots see:
Sorry, but that doesn’t stress me out that much…
– Christian
{ 52 comments… read them below or add one }
The moral of this story is that post combat decompression procedures are crap in all of the armed forces due to a over abundance of tough man syndrome.
I guess you could compare them to snipers. It can be disturbing to see the people you kill and then pull the trigger. With a reaper it might feel like you were an executioner.
But, it sure beats being a grunt with a gun.
Matt
Personally I feel like they have a point. They get to kill day in and day out then count the bodies when you
And how courageous of you, Christian, to call them out…
.. sitting bravely, bravely at your desk.
The comparison to snipers was the first thing that jumped to my mind as well. The good news, if you can call it that, is that the military has trained enough snipers over time that I’d imagine that all those techniques can be used to train these pilots as well.
It has been pointed out in multiple venues that closer connections to the home front are presenting a new avenue of combat stress which has never been present in any active war in the past. It’s happening with boots on the ground who can call home the night after they nearly get blown up by an IED, only to hear about large and small stresses at home. It seems that the unmanned vehicle pilots are having a variation on the same basic problem — they are expected to go from being killers to being parents and husbands (wives?) by getting in their car and going home. When has that ever happened in the past?
What happened to all that supposed video game de-sensativing? Get an Playstation or Xbox interface for the Predator and I am sure you will have thousands of halo-heads ready to go, no moral qualms.
I have a friend who did a tour in Vietnam and as we talked about his experiences he said that even with all of his training he was reluctant to kill someone. That is until he had actually been shot at. After that he said it made it a whole lot easier.
These UAV pilots are not being shot at. I think this makes a lot of difference.
Sorry, but that doesn’t stress me out that much…
That’s because you didn’t pull the trigger, which was the point of the article.
Maybe if you actually did their job for a while, you’d find that you’re not the cold-blooded killer you think you are.
A lot of great comments so far! You feel stress when you really take the responsibility seriously and really understand this ain’t no video game. You have to know and care that if you do your job correctly, your people live and their people die. Do it poorly, and the opposite happens.
Also, don’t forget the surreal work environment. These guys get to immerse themselves in missions for days and then have to go out and live inside the SoCal/Hollywood media spin machine where every local news bimbo feels qualified to criticize the war and empathize with the enemy. Guys in Bagram get more unqualified moral support.
Unless you are sitting in that trailer with them watching them fire the missile or pulling the trigger themselves I’d suggest you shut your piehole Christian.
I know some people in the Predator community, and they are a low-density, high value asset. Because they aren’t dealing with manned aircraft it’s quite normal for them to be at the controls for much longer than would be allowed for “real” Pilots. No one’s taking away from the Kiowa pilot above but let’s be real here stress is stress.
Kole, great point. I was actually thinking about the same thing when I read through the article. I know a number of pilots who’ve come back from Iraq or Afghanistan and you would never know some of what they have been through till you hear stories from their buddies. If they can do it day in and day out on the frontlines why can’t the AF guys handle it from their nice A/C trailers with their families and friends minutes away? These guys need to suck it up and realize there are a lot of people that are having it a lot worse.
Kole and Jeff, I don’t think you guys get it. Kole I know what you are doing is tough and I am sure you are stressed from it but you are letting you macho I can take it tough guy crap get in the way of understanding. Stress is stress, and while you are doing ok now wait 2 or 3 years from now it might not be so easy without some help (I know). Jeff, same thing, stress is stress, years and years of stress can effect a person, some people more than others and your macho crap only does a harm to those people that need some help, need someone to talk to after coming home.
Forget about compairing it to the combat stress of someone getting shot out each day, just think of it as being a very stressful job. Stress is the thing that has pushed to suicide rate for vets to a record level in recent years.
I think this is a bit over critical of the pilots. After all, they didn’t write the article. They just answered a few questions and then it got sensationalized to make it seem like they are complaining about combat stress. This is an example of a psychologist simply promoting his/her own work and the media being the media.
Christian, lighten up.
Servicemen, direct anger at the writers..not the pilots.
The book “On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society”, broaches the history of this subject & was a pretty good read. It is however a bit long in the tooth, though the author has a more recent book called “On Combat: The Psychology and Physiology of Deadly Conflict in War and in Peace”… might be worth checking out.
I commented heavily on this, so I wont clog the blog. I too, mentioned snipers because of the distance and they actually have a count of those they kill. BUT, I’m sorry, call me cold, call me deranged. But, the only stress I would get from doing this everyday would be looking at that drab colored screen everyday. Being a PSP player (Navy SEALS FTB2 rules), looking at non-descript screens and seeing them laid out after what I did, wouldnt bother me AT ALL. I want to see them dead up close so I can torment them. I hate the enemy, view them as sub-human and wish they all would die a thousand times over. For every Marine, Soldier, Sailor or Airmen that perishes, I wish the death of a thousand of them (the enemy) and can see them dead on the street and walk over their filthy corpse and wonder why they were blocking the sidewalk. They are the enemy. Thats the problem with you AF people. You people, need to learn that the enemy is to be viewed as less than human. Once you put a face on him, give him a family, make him out to be a person, then you induce your own stress. To me, looking at it through that screen, they are roaches in need of the foot. I would be stressed because of pure BOREDOM! The enemy is to be destroyed!
I may be an a-hole but, cry me a freakin’ river! Video screens doesn’t even come remotely close to what the Army and Marine grunts experience and see in the ground!
I think the more accurate term would be “air-conditioned cabin” sickness.
I am a grunt so I might be partial to the opinion of dead enemy. I would like to quote one of the comments that I read before I go on with my own thoughts on the mater because it makes some great points. This quote is taken from Leland “I’m sorry, call me cold, call me deranged. But, the only stress I would get from doing this everyday would be looking at that drab colored screen everyday. Being a PSP player (Navy SEALS FTB2 rules), looking at non-descript screens and seeing them laid out after what I did, wouldn
Hey Anonymous at August 8, 2008 06:50 PM aka I am a grunt, that wasnt from Leland, that was from me. The poster’s name is below the post. I had to take credit for my post and I am glad you quoted it as a site of reference for your actual experiences. There is another thread on this where I let loose. Peace brother!
Let’s have a poll!
Unless ‘Anonymous@6:50′ was posting in the middle of a firefight, he is:
a) a poser
b) junior (very) enlisted
c) Guard or Reserve
d) Definitely NOT ‘elite’
e) Lists ‘Drinking’ as his #1 coping skill
f) Needs to see his Chaplin or ‘Top’ about getting some help ASAP.
g) a future homeless Vet unless he does ‘f)’ or something similar soon
h) the ‘Pro’ in ‘professional soldier’
More than one choice is permitted. I’m open to any except “h”
As I see it, the essential point here (regardless of the article’s tone) is not that they’re any more stressed than regular soldiers: it’s that the stresses are different, and less well understood. Being less well understood, perhaps they’re not being as effectively supported as they could be.
Instead of comparing their work to fighter pilots, I think it’d be more appropriate to compare them to gunship pilots and crews. They tend to work closer to the ground, and have higher loiter times in the engagement area. Even then, though, there are some significant differences.
If you’re in a Predator squadron running ops in Iraq from North America, you’ve got distance – physical and psychological – from the enemy. If you’re in an AC-130 crew flying ops in Iraq, you’ve got distance – physical and psychological – from your family and loved ones. Your deployment work is isolated from your day to day life, and that can be a very useful thing for your ability to get the job done.
As most people who’ve ever tried to work from home can tell you, it can be tricky to separate home and work stresses. It’s a lot easier to “check out” from your work worries at your company’s front gate than at the door of your study. Sometimes you need to take careful measures to ensure that you bring your best game to work and step back from it when domestic life ensues. Some people handle that well and others don’t.
It’s not that they have it worse than any other combat warfighters out there – they don’t. They just have different stresses from the old, familiar ones we all know and love. That’s something that 21st Century armed forces need to understand and react to accordingly.
Well, I don’t know about the pilots, but I like seeing those videos on youtube, so keep postin’ em please! Sorry if your all stressed out or whatever, heh.
To add to Dr. Curiosiy’s cogent observations, Andy Rooney wrote in his memoirs about his experience as a WWII correspondent that he thought it tougher for the pilots who flew every so many days from the relative safety of ‘Jolly Old’ into the jaws of Hell and returned only to do it again and again, than the grunts on the front line who would go into the line and stay for long periods of time. Of course at the time, we lost thousands of Airmen and very few were making it through their tours until late in the war — because we were not capable of Air Dominance. (I’m hoping nobody’s out there pinin’ for the old days )
SMSgt Mac, in a word, you are an IDIOT. Because people dont agree with you assessment on the predator pilots, they are “posers” or “in need of therapy or help from a chaplain”. I dont want to address you any further because I feel you are a moron. Please, for the life of anyone worth talking to, please do not comment on a blog and I am in the thread. I will thrash you!
Maurice
Read the entire post a few times then make your post.
Oh boy, look at the posts that got stirred up by this little article. First of all to all of my Infantry/Grunt brethren out there, you guys are awesome. I support you day in and day out and sometimes I wonder how you keep going. I’ve seen some of the places you live in and my hats off to you guys. Just wanted to clarify that I didn
Heh.
Oops, SGTMAC, my apologies. I read the first few choices and flipped. Not to mention, I was sipping some Red Bull and Vodka, so I was speeding a little bit. The Pitbull stands corrected.
No Probs Mon!
Actually, this is a good opportunity to clarify something on my list; lest someone misinterpret why it’s there. The only reason “c) Guard or Reserve” made it on there is that it has been my experience that there is great variability between different Guard and Reserve units on how well they take care of their people and how straight they keep their people’s heads. I think it is harder for the Guard and Reserve because the unit doesn’t have the same day-in day-out relevance to their lives. I even saw it in my nce Uber-Marine (now Former Marine) Son. He’d go to drill, do his annual two-weeker AND a whole lot of extra active time, and he’d come home very time 100% Marine. Within a week or so after drill, or longer in other cases, he’s start to slip into the local slacker culture a bit. the cycle repeated a few times until he got a little older and a little wiser.
So, to wrap up a point: th presence of ‘c)’ is not a reflection of the Guard and Reserve as a whole nor as a stand alone.
I think the Drone pilots are trying to get noticed. I agree they have a very important duty and role in the War. Put them in the desert for a year for a year on the front line in a combat zone and then they might be worthy of their claim. I could watch the drone clips all day long and it has no affect on me or my PTSD.
I wonder if Red legs ( Artillery) have problems when they fire a 155mm from 2 miles away? At least they are still in theater.
Up close and personal is seeing a bullet take out an enemy’s chest through his back.
That’s my take on it.
As an ex IED hunter during 04-05, I can tell you about PTSD. Im so jumpy now I have major problems from it. I find it difficult to believe that you can get PTSD from watching a screen. This is the video game generation. I just have a hard time with this subject, these kids all grew up blowing up pixelated people, how is driving a drone much different? Next lawsuit, world v. Sony for PS3 players suffering from PTSD…..
Drone “pilots” complaining about nightmares too?! My heart goes out to their tormented souls…
What is the biggest “threat” that any drone “pilot” faces: Bad weather in front of his model plane’s camera? I guess that half of them must be war heroes then…
U.S. American PUSSIES : No wonder you LOSE all the wars you start!
Tell it to the Marines you Drone pilot wimps!
I THINK I HAVE PTSD TOO. I PLAY CALL OF DUTY 4 too much, I have nightmares about the ac130 mission where I am busting the shit out jihadi with with gatlin guns!!!!
Drone “pilots” complaining about nightmares too?! My heart goes out to their tormented souls…
What is the biggest “threat” that any drone “pilot” faces: Bad weather in front of his model plane’s camera? I guess that half of them must be war heroes then…
U.S. American PUSSIES : No wonder you LOSE all the wars you start!
Posted by: freefallingbomb at August 10, 2008 08:21 PM
What does that mean, and where are you from?
I bet that these experienced, bemedaled “Iraq War” and “Afghanistan War” heroes also take leaks, drink beers and go shopping whenever they want along the working week err… during their “fierce combats”.
Do these big-hearted giants also wail loud on the couch at mommy’s shoulder while watching happy ends on TV ?
If playing video games traumatizes U.S. American drone “pilots” so much, NEVER EVER count on these “battle-hardened War-on-Terror veterans” in any really dangerous situations (like for example hostage crisis’) :
Just call 911.
Or call the French.
Personally, I’ld love the chance to do what theyre doing. To hold their lives in the palm of my hand, to wipe them out with a push of a button. Those scurvy bastards, kill’em all, well at least the bad ones anyway. HOOOORAHH! U.S. ARMY, VIET NAM ERA!
Get it through your heads, ALL combat is stressful. Anyone who slights these guys are doing them a great didsservice. I can’t believe some of the comments by fellow armed service members.
This is a totally new style of combat. These guys typically are engaging people who don’t even know they are in a fight, then they have to circle around like a vulture and film the aftermath for the higher ups to get their assessments. The fact they live so close to home probably adds to the surrealism of their job.
Finally, what with these comments about videogames? Does anyone honestly think playing a videogame prepares you for the fact you just shredded some real human beings? I hardly think so.
Until we can get people to stop saying things like Christian implying they are pussies, we’ll never get the help these guys need to stay sane while doing a difficult job.
BTW, Christian you owe these guys a sincere apology, I’m disgusted you would slight these guys who’ve done so well supporting the ground forces in harm’s way. I mean a frontpage apology.
i guess ” the cenobyte” isn`t in the military. as a sniper you actually see your victim. sometimes his last facial expressions.dont ever compare me to a joy stick crybaby.
Just when I though I’d seen it all, I read this article. UAV “pilots” are experiencing PTSD? What a load of BS! I have PTSD from serving with SOF, and I’m dealing with it. It’s one thing to see things, but it’s completely different when you smell, hear, and feel the entire situation. Have these so-called warfighters ever had to wipe another person’s entrails off their faces or put one of their comrades in a bodybag? I don’t think so. What’s next? Are people gonna get treated for PTSD after playing Grand Theft Auto or watching violent movies? GIVE ME A BREAK!
SpecOpsVetOEF You are quite the jerk. Yes, you have seen ground combat. But, I don’t understand how you can be so flippant about your comrades in arms. Do you really think they look it like a videogame? I should think not. Do they get another quarter if they mess up and hit friendlies? Do they get to start over if they bombafamily traveling in a car by mistake? Do you honestly think blowing up real people is the same as blowing up video characters?
Noone will argue that the things a groundpounder sees and does isn’t the most stressful thing out of all the types of combat related stresses. But, to laugh these guys off is the most insulting thing I have read here. I’m sure you guys are helping them a lot with your attitude. Why can’t guys like you get over yourselves and understand these pilots have their own stresses to deal with as well.
How about we just recognize there is a problem and get these guys the help they need to do their job effectively.
C O Jones is right on accept WW1 and WW2 and Korean vets had problems similar emotionaly but went by different names such as shelled shocked and few more monickers. Thanks the word hero never applies when it is used today over and out vito722vet
C O Jones is right on accept WW1 and WW2 and Korean vets had problems similar emotionaly but went by different names such as shelled shocked and few more monickers. Thanks the word hero never applies when it is used today over and out vito722vet
I have a great idea. Let’s just designate anyone and everyone who has ever raised their right hand swearing to defend the United States of America a victim of PTSD. We can have them file for PTSD disability right after they are sworn in. Let’s not waste time by waiting until they are discharged, they may accidently see something on the nightly news that could violently disturb them, even while still in Basic Training. Speaking of, Basic Training is pretty mentally intensive itself. So, to be politically correct, let’s also issue a Purple Heart to everyone who has successfully (or unsuccessfully) completed Basic. And forget about AIT school. That for sure screws up military minds. The Government needs to start issuing disability checks to everyone who has ever served in any branch of the US military, regardless of their MOS or where they served! PTSD is surely completely screwing up their entire life as I write this. God, I FEEL sooo much better having written this. But I would feel even better if I had a big official certificate saying I suffer from PTSD, and I have been awarded a Purple Heart for my above & beyond bravery for watching a video, or CNN.
C O Jones is right on accept WW1 and WW2 and Korean vets had problems similar emotionaly but went by different names such as shelled shocked and few more monickers. Thanks the word hero never applies when it is used today over and out vito722vet
I was a sergeant squadleader in a rifle company India Co, 3rd Bn, 25 Marine Regiment. Marines have two things on their minds in combat: accomplish the mission & protect your men. Men kill to protect themselves & their fellow grunts. Predator drivers kill, but have no immediate justification for it. They don’t have the shared risk and sense of relief when you can say” Yeah, I killed that guy, but if I hadn’t, he would have killed some of us. It must be rough to fire a missle at a carload of insurgents, count up the bloody arms, legs, heads & bits of people, then go home to your kids soccer game. If you haven’t done it, you will have difficulty understanding it. There are two things that really scare infantrymen: getting separated from your unit, and running out of ammunition in enemy terrritory.
It’s a whole helluva lot different when you have to stay in the area where all of the carnage took place. These guys have it easy. Once they’re done with their duties for the day, they can go home and spend time with their families. It makes a big difference when you have to kill people and then occupy the area, living among the stench of corpses swelling and baking in the sun. Yes, I’m sure they have some bad feelings when it comes to what they have to do, but I feel that it could be far worse. Ask any other groundpounder for sympathy, and they’ll tell you where you can find it. I’m a jerk? I’m very offended by your brutal insult. *sarcasm* Give the treatment to the men who have truly suffered. These “pilots” can try to secure a spot on Dr. Phil. And yes, I AM AN ASSHOLE, but I’ve more than earned my right to speak on this subject.
Just as I have the right to say you’re a jerk. I see a lot of people here jumping on these guys butts. For what? They had the balls to admit that some of them are having issues and could use some help. Yeah instead of some simple counseling let’s all mock them. They haven’t seen what you have or did what you did so they’re lesser men for it. Give us a break.
You are all forgetting something. After combat they go home… They know we are unable to do that. Think… My God the guilt that these airmen carry. They have brothers in arm in harms way. Some of thier friends never come home My heart goes out to you I understand Surviver Guilt We all have it. YES ALL OF US HAVE IT. Why get up in anger when our brothers and sisters are asking for help. They are not whining. They are not crying about doing there duty. They are asking for help in dealing with their issues. I have served in Iraq, I have served in Afghanistan. I have PTSD the ARMY ISNT HELPING ME but why should any one, ANY ONE OF US BE TREATED UNFAIRLY, UNKINDLY, WE NEED TO STICK TOGETHER. we are the only help we hve at this time. QUIT your letting us get divided. We need to UNITE so we all can get the help we need.
SSG James Rader
Absolutely NONE of these kids today are heroes of any sort. Why is the job still unfinished?
The real men of yesterday finished their jobs and needed nobody to hold their hands.
Suicide? We should furnish the guns and ammo. Every last one of them should off themselves and then go to you know where.
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i love watching these videos. its not that im all crazy about killing people, but its just cool to watch these testiments of the power of the U.S. Military and feel lucky that im on ur side. i just cant get enough of these videos. if these pilots feel like they cant take this anymore, ill gladly take thier seat.