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How Can You be Afraid of These Guys?

by christian on September 24, 2010

“Oh no, Iran’s going to get the bomb and nobody’s going to do anything about it…”

“You think Iraq was tough, just try to go up against the Iranian military…”

I know, I know…There’s plenty of reason why the US should avoid any military conflict with Iran over its nuclear program (assuming they even have one). The pitfalls of a kinetic conflict are too numerous to count.

But if the latest pics of the Iranian military parade commemorating the Iran/Iraq war are any indication, the real threat from Tehran is suspect from a conventional military sense. I mean, how embarrassed would you be sitting in that tin can torpedo stolen from a 1930s Buck Rogers set wearing a surplus Korean War Frogman suit? It’s absurd…

But, I gotta give the Persian Mullahs credit, they sure know how to trick out a four-wheeler!

– Christian

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{ 141 comments… read them below or add one }

broken September 24, 2010 at 1:33 pm

looks like they're wearing a "multi-sham" knock off, knock off!!

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Bob September 24, 2010 at 2:36 pm

The Iranians are better equiped than the Taliban, and the Taliban seem to be giving us a hard time.. I would not discount them. Those buck rogers subs just might make it past our our high tech anti-sub gear.

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Jacob September 24, 2010 at 4:57 pm

The Taliban operate through stealthy insurgent tactics, and the whole point of an insurgency is that you want to blend in and look like a civilian….which these guys above don't look too good at.

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Wildcard September 24, 2010 at 6:49 pm

I doubt the uniforms are surgically attached to their bodies… if it were to ‘kick off’ I’m sure it is possible they could doff those uniforms, acquire civilian clothes and begin an Iraqi style insurgency.

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Tomato juice September 24, 2010 at 5:52 pm

The US excels at conventional warfare. How many days does it take to rock Iraqi military twice?

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Hunter78 September 24, 2010 at 8:03 pm

Yes, look how short and wonderful the Iraq War was.

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Tomato juice September 24, 2010 at 8:44 pm

I suppose you, Hunter78 can tell the difference between to two. Let alone reply to my comment.

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Tomato juice September 24, 2010 at 8:44 pm

cant*

jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:43 pm

but iran has a conventional army. look at what happened to iraqs. ripped apart in weeks. Iran will be no different since our troops would have actual targets before them that aren't wearing jeans and t shirts, and gun them down.

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nightsta1ker October 5, 2010 at 10:36 pm

Except I don't think the Iranian army would fight assymetrically like the Taliban does. The U.S has the extreme advantage in any contemporary modern combat. Guerrillas and insurgents who deliberately break the rules when they need to and then hold us to them to turn the media against us are a far more difficult enemy, even if they are less equipped. Also, when you see an enemy soldier in uniform, you aim, and pull the trigger. I don't think I have ever stared down the barrel of a gun at someone wearing a uniform, and I have ALWAYS had doubts.

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randy November 19, 2010 at 10:10 am

with Iran we would know who we are fighting not the cowards of the Taliban

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STemplar September 24, 2010 at 2:53 pm

I hope dude on the back of the quad doesn't think he is firing the RPG over my shoulder, uh uh….

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Joe America September 24, 2010 at 3:35 pm

That's almost as funny as riding a rubber raft up next to a USN Destroyer and almost blowing it in half.

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john September 24, 2010 at 4:14 pm

Yup, Joe America. I had similar thoughts. Could that ridiculous looking torpedo actually be a workable suicide vessel? And when our SF troops rolled into Kuwait on go-karts no one thought it was silly or ineffective, if my memory serves me correctly.
Whether or not it does I can tell you factually as a combat veteran that the thought of soldiers coming at you on multiple ATV's with gunners firing machine guns on each one is a daunting thought.

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Dave M. September 24, 2010 at 4:51 pm

Can you even shoot those things in front of you? There's nowhere to stand. They'd have to be driving in reverse.

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Project_Thor September 24, 2010 at 5:55 pm

And I, as a combat veteran, would almost die from laughter, just before i asked our 240 gunner to cut them in half.

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jsallison September 27, 2010 at 9:52 pm

Gunner! Coax! Troops, baby…

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pacwaters September 27, 2010 at 5:33 pm

They weren't go karts. I lrped in a jeep with a M-60 mounted amy years ago. Can't hit shi on the move. No need to be afraid but don't underestimate either. We use atv's and bikes because they are a good platform for mobility and RPG's hurt. It would all come down to tactics. As for taliban giving us a hard time. They have sanctuary., When they stand and fight they die. Of course I wouldn't want to be out there in Ft. Apache. As for blasting a SK ship out of the water, it probably wasn't one of these. They don't do well in open water. That's not what they are designed for. These sort of craft have never had more than limited success.

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STemplar September 24, 2010 at 4:24 pm

I suppose if a US ship were tied up in port, and we weren't paying attention at all, someone might not spot Buck Rogers in his magic bullet ship, but I doubt it. Beyond being in port, you wouldn't catch me signing up to try and pilot that thing near a multi thousand ton vessel moving 20 knots.

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Mark Pyruz September 24, 2010 at 5:08 pm

Christian,
That first weapon type is the Al Sabehat 15” Swimmer Delivery Vehicle (Submersible) . It's been a feature of Iranian military parades for years now. The USN SEALs actually possess SDVs, although there's are more expensive and sophisticated. Same concept, though.

As to the ATV combat teams, the Iranians appear to be moving up from their reliance on motorcycles. ATVs are more stable and are capable of portaging weapons and equipment. So it's a natural progression.

-Mark Pyruz

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STemplar September 24, 2010 at 5:27 pm

How would they swarm us? I mean it is was a big surprise during the war games when we did it to ourselves, but since then we get it. Since then we are aware. I suppose if they just up and decided one day to come out willy nilly and attack for no apparent reason they could inflict some damage. Any other scenario generally involves naval and air force aviation annihilating their port facilities before they even know what is going on.

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Jonathan November 26, 2010 at 5:45 pm

Yeah but why didnt we get it before?

And you have to be scared of what we still dont get.

Our military and intelligence has shown alot of incompetance. We need smarter people who understand war and the weapons we face, and spending our money on the most practical weapons to deter them.

Expensive planes and bombs that cost billions and millions of dollars are nice, but wouldnt triple or quadruple the amount of almost as good planes and bombs be better? Our rocket artillery is nice, but Iran has rocket artillery that costs 1/100th of ours, and has 1/3 of our capability. Its things like that we need to think about. For the cost of one of our fighter jets, we could have 1,000 vietnam era CAS planes. If we can control the sky with our SAMS do we need billion dollar fighter jets? No we dont. We would be better off with the 1000 vietnam era planes.

The RPG is a good example. They make them by the boat load. Our AT rocket the SLAM or whatever costs 100X more and has the same capability.

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blight January 11, 2012 at 12:51 pm

Ironically, our MLRS is pretty good bang/buck, especially when ported to FMTVs (HIMARS) and the option for ATACMS and smart rockets. The Iranians likely are using Grads and such.

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Mohsen35 December 13, 2011 at 6:38 pm

lol.are u sure of that.hehe.good jock.you are ended so many years ago .read iran history.read koran.you will know why…

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blight January 11, 2012 at 1:32 pm

The Persians lost because they were exhausted from a long war with the Romans and disunified from the inside.

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Sev September 24, 2010 at 6:18 pm

Just expct swar attack tactics at sea. They'll try to overwhelm our defense systems. As for the ATVS…..idk. Just cut them in half. Although they'll probably employ IEDs and civilians to do most of the fighting.

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nadstornia September 24, 2010 at 7:00 pm

STemplar appears to be holding the edge here along with a few couple of other people who are posting. Do you really think Iran has the conventional capabilities to heavily intimidate US and Allied forces? The US as well as it's allies have the ability to cause a tremendous amount of damage to the Iranians before they are even able to organize and retaliate. If my sources are correct, the US only needs 6-8 B-2A Block 31 Spirit Stealth Bombers to neutralize a sophisticated network of SAMs and Radar/Communication infrastructures related to them. Thats just a fraction of our military stength wiping out a large chunk of the Iranians military power to progress actively against the US. Naval-wise, despite Iranian advancement in technology for surface/subsurface vessels the US has the ability to crush the Iranian Navy which most likely has little to nada experiance. Take a look at the USNs power to project force with just (1) Aircraft Carrier Battle Group and the Iranians will think twice before initating a Naval clash with the Americans.

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Bob September 25, 2010 at 8:42 am

Well maybe if we arn't fighting in Astan. Iraq, N. Korea, and maybe Mexico or some other Latin American country all at the same time. Where is it written that we will only face hostile forces one at a time and in one location at a time? We don't have a 8-10 million man military like we did in WWII. It would take us several years to even begin to train one, not to mention build the ships, planes and tanks. Our allies are a joke, and also have very small militaries.

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STemplar September 25, 2010 at 12:32 pm

I wouldn't expect we would invade Iran. If there were some ground option it would be something limited like taking Natanz to disable it without causing a huge environmental issues. Pretty much the USN and USAF knocking down everything important to the regime otherwise. We definitely have a full plate though geopolitically. Makes the case for creativity in defense spending a new ways of deploying force for sure.

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praetorian September 27, 2010 at 11:48 am

I thought the goal for Iran would be to cut the flow of oil, by swarming the Gulf.
Hence the big Saudi arms deal. Not out right attacking the U.S. fleet.

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 4:31 pm

I suppose that's what they say, but at the end of the day it's a lot of hot air. Shipping companies probably won't line up to move product for Iran if it starts popping off anti ship cruise missiles at tankers. Kind of self destructive really. To say nothing of the fact they'll get about one afternoon of pulling that card out before US air power begins to disassemble every port and air field up and down their coast.

I'm not really sure what real game Iran has besides the asymmetric dirty bomb threat, and some kind of proxy non-sense out of Lebanon. I personally think they are running out of rope.

Cyberarms September 24, 2010 at 7:03 pm

It's the typical Mid-East Rhetoric. Anyone remember Comical Ali?

"The US is not in Baghdad and nowhere near Iraq! As a matter of fact…" – Comical Ali
"Umm… Excuse me, can you move? We need to park our Abrams here" – Tank Commander

cyberarms.wordpress.com

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Philo September 26, 2010 at 9:07 pm

Got Cyberarms? LOL ;)

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Mike January 11, 2012 at 9:45 am

Your thinking of Baghdad Bob. He is the one who reported on TV everyday that they were in complete contol of everything, when clearly they were not. Chemical Ali (not comical Ali) was one of Saddams close relatives who dropped WMD's on the KURDs. Just a few minor mistakes, but who cares about being correct.

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blight January 11, 2012 at 12:50 pm

Chemical Ali was a first cousin of Saddam.

Baghdad Bob was indeed nicknamed "Comical Ali", weirdly enough (the man's name is Mohammed)

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Adam September 24, 2010 at 7:13 pm

It seems like a parade for the masses and not a real show of the country's military might. A combination of disinformation and culture that likes shiny things. Heck the Iraqi police would wrap their ak's in gold or silver tape to make them look "cool" or even tape a scope that you would find on a bb gun on top of their ak's and call themselves snipers. If it can't be used as a deterrent than why give away a capability.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:58 pm

Really. appeasing the masses with atvs. That will make your citizens think your a great power! HA!!!!

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daniel February 20, 2013 at 8:19 am

just remember, "an ounce of appearance is worth a pound of performance". lol

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Hellfish September 24, 2010 at 7:33 pm

It all comes down to the ROE. If the US government decides to tie the hands of the US military during another war between nations then the Iranian weapons will have some effect. If the US government treats hostile nations as the should – with a ROE intended to treat an enemy that wishes to destroy their way of life as it should treat them – then the US Military would annihilate Iran. It may cost a few civilian shields but these should be placed at the feet of the "insurgents" – not the US.

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prometheusgonewild September 24, 2010 at 8:08 pm

Sure, laugh at the ATV's.
They are quick; cheap; easy to resupply; good on gas; and unlike all of our equipment, can make really good time off road. Easy to hide, hard to find….
A couple hundred of these could play havoc with our supply lines. Especially in mountainous terrain.
Not saying they could go head to head with us.
Just that making fun of a bunch of guys on quads is a bad idea.
Quads are much more capable than Jeeps, and Jeeps mounted with machine guns and antitank weapons have had success in North Africa in WW2 and in 1967 in Israel….
Granted, not recent conflicts, but like I said, they are much more capable than Jeeps….

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Donnell September 25, 2010 at 10:54 pm

To Prometheusgonewild.
Perhaps you have'nt noticed that all the US support vehicles have been up armoured because of the war in Iraq and the transportation units that drive these trucks have been trained and real world experience have taught them to be hard targets and every movement is under taken as a movement to contact. They can defend themselfs from some guys on a ATV and I see those guys on the ATV are very exposed. I believe that the Iranians would be very shocked if they were confronted with a US ground assault as the Iraq's were. If my memory serves me right, these Iranians could not defeat the Iraq's in ten years of fighting and the US military made it to Baghdad in less than 30 days,But then I'm sure the occupation would 'nt be easy at all.

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jsallison September 28, 2010 at 8:01 pm

Occupy Persia? Why bother? They’ve been a thorn in the side of Western Civ for millenia. Flatten their asses and in 30 years when a new crop of yahoos pokes their heads above the horizon, do it again, and again. Eventually they’ll get a clue.

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jsallison September 28, 2010 at 7:58 pm

easy to hide…think thermal. I’ll guarantee the Persians aren’t. This is theatre of the absurd for them.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:46 pm

yeah why don't u ride one aganist a bunch of humvees armed with 50 cals and perhaps support gunships hovering around. those flyers would be itching for some juicy explodable targets after a decade of fighting insurgents.

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STemplar September 24, 2010 at 8:26 pm

Why would we invade Iran? At least the whole thing anyway? I think, I hope we learned our lesson in Iraq. Quite honestly Iran is doing a fabulous job of annoying its own people to the point they will probably oust the leadership themselves at some point.

Now having said that, militarily we aren't contemplating an invasion. Any military option is more than likely be a rolling series of air strikes over 2 or 3 weeks, during which time we would more or less sink their navy, destroy their air defenses, degrade their nuclear and missile infrastructure, and probably hit as many Revolutionary Guard facilities as we could find. That would give the Iranian govt plenty to worry about right at home in regards to clinging to power.

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Riceball September 27, 2010 at 10:58 am

I don't know about that, I imagine that on file somewhere are plans for an invasion of Iran. That's not to say that I believe the US government or military are serious about wanting to invade Iran but I'd be surprised if a contingency plan for just an event doesn't exist. Hell, we probably still have plans on file for the invasion/war plan against the UK like we decades ago, we probably have plans for war against the invasion of just about every nation in the world just in case we need to attack or invade a given nation. During the years before WW II the US had various plans on file for conducting wars against Germany & Japan as well as other nations.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:54 pm

applause for you. your the only one thinking here. Plus, most iranian college students are to smart to oblige in war with the US. the uS is waning but still powerfull.

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Byron Skinner September 24, 2010 at 10:21 pm

Good Evening Folks,

As I recall the Soviet Union use to have great military parades that lasted for hours. By the way what ever happened to them, after reading this post I sure do miss those parades.

What really impressed me is the white sidewall road wheels in the BMP’s and the T-** or what ever tanks were the latest. The Chinese still are the best of the current crop of parader’s, those paint jobs the Chinese have “way cool”.

ALLONS,
Byron Skinner

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Joe America September 24, 2010 at 10:46 pm

Iranian version of a British SAS "Rat Patrol".

Yeah, they could hit and run and make some havoc on a supply route.

Think unconventional.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:53 pm

Like the Iranians would do that. in the 1980s war with Iraq, they used human waves. Plus, if they used unconventional, we are too experienced in fighting that type of warfare

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David September 24, 2010 at 11:07 pm

Whatever Israel wants the west must comply. Not sure why though.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:52 pm

religious reasons. and they kind of hate its neighbors except for eygpt. During the 50s the arabians backstabbed the europeans, obviously making them pissed off.

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Yamas@#ita September 25, 2010 at 12:23 am

Well it would take Iran a century to spend as much on their Military as we spend in less than a year on ours. So, yeah, if Israel says we have to bomb the knowledge of how to make an A-bomb out of existence, we’ll, I suppose we’ll just have to comply. Yeah the 51st state! Go Jews!

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roland September 25, 2010 at 2:16 am

I am wondering why they are wearing US uniform and riding on a US made dune buggy.

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fred September 27, 2010 at 6:45 am

A sale is a sale.
Remember Iran/Contra?

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Oblat September 25, 2010 at 5:50 am

US military spending is over 100 times that of Iran but it is so terribly inefficient that Americans have good reason to be scared of Iran. So far the Iranians have already won one proxy war against us and then we scored an own goal by handing them Iraq. Lebanon and Afghanistan are also turning out nicely for them.
.
The sort of schoolboy boasting you see here is a measure of that insecurity it is part an parcel of a military that still sees its main job as impressing the Russians not winning wars.

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STemplar September 25, 2010 at 6:30 pm

Somehow I don' t think having gasoline imports banned from your country or major air defense systems nixed qualifies as things working out well for Iran. I also think statements like handing them Iraq or things are working for them in Stan are just inflammatory trolling non sense. Iraq is trying to negotiate an open coalition government as a result of a free election, as opposed to Iran, which really doesn't have elections at all. We didn't hand them anything except an opposition in their country that was willing to march in the millions against armed thugs.

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Philo September 26, 2010 at 9:04 pm

iranistan won a proxy war against the US? And we're so terribly inefficient that we're bar-none the greatest military power on the planet? Hmmmm

Oblat, I'd say you suffer from a nationalist form of "penis envy". But keep posting bud, your "insight" is always good for a chuckle…

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Philo September 26, 2010 at 9:09 pm

iranistan won a proxy war against the US? And we're so terribly inefficient that we're bar-none the greatest military power on the planet? Hmmmm

Oblat suffers from a serious case of nationalist "Penis Envy". But keep posting bud, you're always good for a chuckle..

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mooallah September 25, 2010 at 8:22 am

If they fight our Marines they will get thier butts whipped, if they fought our overweight, drugged addicted Army is where we would have trouble

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Bob September 25, 2010 at 8:48 am

Marines are not supermen. The Army has units every bit as good, or better than Marine units.

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blight September 25, 2010 at 10:27 am

Gotta love this Armed Services mythos crap.

Chuck Norris eats Marines for breakfast. An equally ludicrous statement.

And I suspect the troops at Ft Benning and Bragg have something to say about "overweight, drugged addicted".

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Donnell September 25, 2010 at 11:03 pm

Wow! Overweight Drug addicted Army, Its obvious you are clueless…

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Ian James September 27, 2010 at 12:08 pm

We got plenty of overweight drug addicted Marines too……frankly I trust some soldiers that I've seen more than I do some of the Marines that I live and work with

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jsallison September 28, 2010 at 8:08 pm

I believe that we’ve ample evidence to see that they, of whatever branch, will do what’s needful. Even if they aren’t Cavalry, more’s the pity. ;)

Overweight and drug addicted? So What? You left out well trained, experienced and well armed, dont’cha know? Their appearance in the offishul DA/DN photo means %*#*all when the shooting starts.

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Jeff September 25, 2010 at 1:09 pm

I think you are all missing the point, if conventional weapons were all Iran had NO ONE would care. The concern comes from their (known) chemical weapons arsenal and their interest (pursuit) in biological and nuclear weapons systems, piggy backed with their leaps in delivery systems such as the 1,200 – 1,800 mile ranged Shahab 3 and 4 and even the 200 mile ranges Fateh 110's. Their air force, navy and AD elements would give us little trouble. If in 1-2 years they parade a 2,500 mile ranged Shahab-5 and confirm they can successfully deploy a 20 kt nuclear fission bomb on it well you still feel the same way?

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Rob September 25, 2010 at 1:59 pm

I'd still feel same because any declaration of such weapons would turn neutral countries to our side.

If they used any kind of chemical , bio or nuclear weapon we would be forced to use carpet bomb and tactical nukes.

Iran is not much bigger then Alaska. The only 2 countries they can threaten are Iraq and Israel. But we have their backs.

whats sad is all we need to do is drop sanctions and form a 3 party non-aggressive agreement between Isreal US and them . Then they would not be so defensive &bad mouth us so much.

They consider Isreal an occupation of aggression. Continually expanding. Until it stops they will continue to dispute us for supporting them.

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jsallison September 28, 2010 at 8:21 pm

I’d still feel same because any declaration of such weapons would turn neutral countries to our side.

- nazzofast, guido. I’d like to believe that, but, and it’s a pretty damn big, but.

If they used any kind of chemical , bio or nuclear weapon we would be forced to use carpet bomb and tactical nukes.

- doctrinally speaking, yes, but does the big O give a crap about our doctrine? I’mna thinking…..no.

Iran is not much bigger then Alaska. The only 2 countries they can threaten are Iraq and Israel. But we have their backs.

- pretty much same answer, adjusted appropriately, to the previous assertion.

whats sad is all we need to do is drop sanctions and form a 3 party non-aggressive agreement between Isreal US and them . Then they would not be so defensive &bad mouth us so much.

- you’re kidding, right? On your planet are all the ponies pastel-colored and shortlegged with big fluffy manes and tails?

They consider Isreal an occupation of aggression. Continually expanding. Until it stops they will continue to dispute us for supporting them.

- Therefore, we should explain to them in excruciating detail what it means to piss us off. Oh! Oh! Can I pick Make the Rubble Bounce in Tehran for $100, Alex? We so $&*#ed that up in ’79, don’tcha know?

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STemplar September 25, 2010 at 7:11 pm

No, I think we are all aware of Iran's nuclear program, we are simply making fun of this sill piece if junk mini sub, I mean honestly, look at the sheet metal, it's like something that was tack welded together in high school shop. The whole MG toting quads are a good idea for scouts, or a SOCCOM unit on a LRRP in rough terrain, but it isn't like Iran has the logistical capacity to support a viable ground force of any kind.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:50 pm

Iraq had biological weapons too, what good did it do for them? Plus, the US would just attack Iran with air strikes. why bother sending in troops? to produce another iraq? hell no.

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derry September 25, 2010 at 2:57 pm

One of those "silly" mini subs recently blasted a South Korean frigate out the water. The frigate was at battle stations yet didn't detect the torpedo and was sunk in minutes.

I think out tin cans packed with missiles is far more absurd.

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STemplar September 25, 2010 at 6:16 pm

Not even close to the same system.

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blight September 25, 2010 at 7:20 pm

This depicted vessel is much smaller than anything that could be legitimately called a sub or a mini sub. A IJN WW2 era midget submarine weighed in at 46 tons and 78 feet long. The end-of-war mini subs were even smaller, and this might even be a little shorter than the Kaiten suicide torpedoes.

Hypothetically, the Cheonan was probably brought down by a SangO class sub; or perhaps some other system in their inventory. The Sang-O's are much heavier than an IJN midget sub.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:49 pm

the north korean sub was far more advanced then the iranian ones. i mean north korea has been making them for decades since they can barely build romeo class subs.

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tom September 25, 2010 at 9:07 pm

roland

I am wondering why they are wearing US uniform and riding on a US made dune buggy.

derry

One of those "silly" mini subs recently blasted a South Korean frigate out the water. The frigate was at battle stations yet didn't detect the torpedo and was sunk in minutes.

I think out tin cans packed with missiles is far more absurd.

–both of these guys are right the guys on quads are wearing our uniforms (bdu's to be specific) have our m-60s or the m-240b we use now mounted on the back of american made quads im not so sure those photos are real. as far as the sub goes thats true n. korea sank a s. korean ship undetected while it was at battle stations doing maneuvers so you might not want to make fun of them yet cause that attack shows that our sophisticated sub detection equipement is unable to pick up an old diesel powered ww2 era sub so dont think we'll crush them.

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tom September 25, 2010 at 9:31 pm

ok so i saw more of the photos of the guys on the quads i take back what i said about them being fake but i still say everything else

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blight September 26, 2010 at 12:40 pm

The guns on the ATVs are MG3's. Look closely.

The M60 is probably not worth cloning, and getting FN MAG from FN Herstal is probably easier than trying to steal M240's from Iraq? (Though I suppose the latter is possible…)

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Mat September 27, 2010 at 8:31 am

Indeed the guns on ATV are MG3 clones ,i have recently been to Iran and things there all prior to 1979 after that not much happened,development is poor only local products and cheap chinese and korean stuff.Due to sanctions Islamsits are being kept in power.That is one thing that US never learned that wholesale sanctions only hurt people but do nothing to the people in power only strenghten their hold on to it. And one thing interesting there is that people are not very religous and hate their goverment ,in many respects iranians are less of a threat in terms of terrorism than saudis that fund 80+% fo world terrorism who on the other hand are US's BFF even tough most 911 attackers and all the funders were saudis

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STemplar September 26, 2010 at 1:27 pm

Where did you get your information that the Cheonan was at battle stations, because the official report says it was not?

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galloglas September 27, 2010 at 12:11 pm

That's an MG-3 German made MG Dude. The uniforms are similar fershure.
The Cheonan was not at Mat Con Zebra when it was attacked.

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roland September 26, 2010 at 1:01 am

I think it's just a float and symbol that was displayed on the parade. Not a real thing. The man riding on a ellipse figure float could be symbolizing a jehadist man riding a nuclear bomb or maybe a giant toilet bowl. They know they are on international camera.

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roland September 26, 2010 at 1:12 am

On the other hand the man (Quad) riding a ellipse figure float could just be a symbol for a mini submarine. They are building these mini submarine since April of 2006.
http://conflictiran.blogspot.com/2006/04/iranian-
http://www.france24.com/en/20100808-iran-launches
http://www.janes.com/news/defence/jni/jni100817_1

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roland September 26, 2010 at 1:43 am
Repent September 26, 2010 at 7:26 am

We should not even think of war with Iran while Obama is president. These Islamic fighters are weapons themselves, not afraid of dying and will fight to the death.

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roland September 26, 2010 at 9:54 am

Whatever happens Jesus Christ is the answer to all wars,confict , hunger, unemployment and even death. He is the alpha and omega. Gold, treasures, atomic bomb will rust and fade. Life on earth is temporary. But life with Jesus Christ is ethernal. Until you known and accept Jesus Christ is your lord, God and saviour you will not be save.

John 3:3 (Whole Chapter)
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

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mat September 27, 2010 at 8:40 am

If any of you were ever to iran you would know that iran would very quickly run out of islamists as the people are probably most secular of all in the middle east but the goverment is run by religous zealots,so what we see on TV are only their politicians and religous leaders .
Its quite ironic that iranians hate their goverment for being too religious on the other hand most middle eastern goverments are seen by their people as too western and not religious enough.

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jsallison September 28, 2010 at 8:12 pm

And we’ve got lots of folk ready, willing, and able to help them on their path to the hereafter.

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Benjamin September 26, 2010 at 11:09 am

I wonder how many rounds that they can get off before they do damage to the mount and the ATV.

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blight September 26, 2010 at 12:44 pm

It's just a GPMG. It looks like a pedestal mount bolted onto the back of an ATV. The design is not optimal for sustained fire, as the only place to carry spare ammo is up front, and when the gunner is out of ammo there's no obvious place to stash ammo close to the rear.

Anybody notice that perpendicular bar that goes near the gunner's shoulder? Anybody know what its for?

I suspect it may be a MG3 designed to be fired mounted on the pedestal or dismounted. Imagine an MG3 team hiding out, ambusing a unit and then dashing off to the ATV and zipping away, with the gunner covering the retreat of the ATV with machinegun fire.

I'd be more concerned if they figured out how to put a recoiless rifle or a TOW missile onto one. But you'd need a bigger ATV maybe…

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Ian James September 27, 2010 at 12:19 pm

That bar that is perpendicular to the mount for the MG is an RPG tube

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blight September 27, 2010 at 6:28 pm

RPGs and machineguns are basically out of the Chechen playbook. Just hide in a mosque or a hospital, lay an ambush, then bolt for it on an ATV into a crowd.

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crackedlenses September 28, 2010 at 9:56 am

How are you going to hide when the streets are filled with people protesting your government?

OneofMany September 26, 2010 at 9:54 pm

Underestimating the enemy is huge mistake. I thought Millennium Challenge 2002 taught us that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Challenge

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 12:07 am

We got it, no one is underestimating anything. That sub pictured is a joke. Guys on quads is interesting, but we have stuff that I'm confident will make a mess of guys on quads and Johnny Quest mini subs. Iran's conventional capacity is a farce and in one good afternoon, we could sink their navy, eliminate their air force, and disable their air defenses. The real threat with Iran is they give a canister of 20% enriched Uranium to some fool who packs it in a bomb in a crowded urban center and detonates it.

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amauyong September 27, 2010 at 1:01 am

To STemplar · 2 days ago

Those are MG 3 copies of the MG42…

Seems the Iranians believe in "fire-power"…

Being fired on or suppressed by an MG 3 / MG 42 is no joking matter…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MG_42

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 3:21 am

Did I imply anywhere being shot at with a medium machine gun is a joke? I don't think I did. I just don't see some guys on quads with medium MGs tipping the balance of power in the Gulf that's all.

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amauyong September 27, 2010 at 4:31 am

To STemplar September 27, 2010 at 3:21 am

No no…i am not implying you are stating it as a joke…i am sorry if it comes across as that…

I mean to all and sundry….it seems this vehicle is supposed to be able to do many “funny” things…

1) The mounted MG 3/ MG 42 – Anti-infantry…and maybe anti-aircraft? Since the way the MG is mounted.

2) A backup anti-armor/fortication support guy with that RPG…wonder what the back blast be like if fired from the vehicle.

3) The vehicle is small – “air portable behind the lines capability” perhaps…do the iranians have a parachute unit…no scratch that capability.

4) Vehicle is purposely also designed to work at very “short” range…the size of the fuel tank shows it all….maybe support within walking or marching distance of ground pounders?

5) Finally, the speed of the vehicle is suspect…perhaps this vehicle is some kind of diversion ‘suicide’ type targets to save “high” value armor assets when defending or attacking another “armored” or “entrenched/attacking” forces?

I think all the above “conventional” stuff they put out in that “parade” is possibily a red herring….once the Iranians have real working “nukes”…we will see them getting real “demanding” and “intrusive-like” in that part of the world with the thinking that might makes right.

Neutral party.

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amauyong September 27, 2010 at 5:31 am

To STemplar…

Mein apologies…i am not implying you are making a joke out of it…

I mean all and sundry folks that MG 3/MG 42 is a real pain dealer…forgot to add all after you STemplar….

Again mein apologies.

To all…the iranians "in-charged" class basic primary over-ridding objective is to get or secure real working "nukes"…with these in hand…these upper in charge folks will believe people must "fold" to their demands. Once you give in to a bully…it never stops.

Look no further then the current spat between China and Japan….please note the Chinese boat captain rammed the japanese patrol boat [photos has show its sides badly damaged]…that is a deliberate "murdering" act….and yet…. China is demanding Japan to give in. A bully using its "economical" clout to get what it whats…once you give in…where will it stop.

Doesn't look good for all in the end.

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fred September 27, 2010 at 6:50 am

"Any attempt of Iran to expand territory"

Care to point me to where they've ever said they want to?

"Kuwaiti, Qatari, Saudi Arabia" forces are a joke. Sure they have the hardware, sold to them by the west, but the skills to use them, and the willingness to get their hands dirty? No way.

"Their surrounded by wolves ready to pounce."

They certainly are, which is why they are jumpy.

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galloglas September 27, 2010 at 12:02 pm

ATV's give off heat while operating, heat can be located by IR and targetted.
The only defense is to turn the ATV off which means the ATV crew become just another MG/RCL nest to bypass or over run.
The sub can sail under a parked ship and do damage, hard to spot and detect. A moving ship would require the sub to sit and wait for an intersection of paths to explode which requires air and patience.
To take out either would take a series of depth bombs for the subs and air dropped mines in their path.
Not a battle winner for sure but a good way for the iranian's to cause casualties.

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 1:54 pm

The silly sub does not have the range to just sail out from port into the Gulf and find a USN vessel to park under. Look at it, it has zero comm, no radar, a tiny fuel tank. The Gulf is over a hundred miles across, they are not going to sail out into open water in that beer can and find anything. If they use a mother ship, that will easily fall under surveillance. The USN has a vast amount of persistant ISR in the air watching the Straits and oil platforms, manned and unmanned.

I don't quite know what scenario people envision for some kind of conflict in the Gulf with Iran. If people think the Iranians are just going to sail out into the Gulf in their missile boats and mini subs and we aren't watching, then never mind underestimating Iran, there are folks here that don't have clue one about the ISR capacity we have in the Gulf right now.

If they take some kind of pot shot at some tankers it is going to be a very brief engagement. Operation Praying Mantis is a good example of just how quickly the USN will savage Iranian naval forces

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crackedlenses September 27, 2010 at 6:59 pm

The Army had to bail the Navy out on that one with the OH-58s, if I remember correctly….

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blight September 27, 2010 at 7:39 pm

Are you thinking of Operation Prime Chance? (Run at essentially the same time as Praying Mantis)

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crackedlenses September 29, 2010 at 9:20 am

It was a mission to protect Kuwaiti tankers in the Gulf during the Iraq-Iran war, and the Navy was being driven crazy by hit-and-run attacks by Iranian small craft with RPGs, so the Army sent in Specops AH-6s and drove off the Iranians….

shawn1999 September 27, 2010 at 1:37 pm

While I do agree they look ridiculous, let's also not forget how a bunch of ragtag farmers and hunters cause much trouble for the British about 234 years ago…. We need to ensure that we do not underestimate these loons because a nutjob with gun is perhaps more dangerous- at least a sane person is still willing to listen to logic and reason.

What I would be worried about most is the fact that these things are so cheap, they can be sent out and replaced in rapid succession. Even if every third or fourth actually works (due to faulty design or decoy tactics), it would still be difficult to stop many (in fact, I would even send a bunch of empties first so when they do breach, connect and fail to detonate, the opponent would have a false sense of security).

Combine this with an ability to use those cheap, cost effective quads to move small units/armaments quickly, and the IRG's knowledge of asymmetric warfare -because you know any fight with Iran is going to include them, in fact I wouldn't be surprised if Iran put its army in front as a shield and delaying tactic for the IRG to to evacuate its leadership and initiate guerrila warfare

We just have to trust in our military leaders to have plans and procedures in place and troops trained to deal with such attacks.

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Philo September 28, 2010 at 1:21 pm

"…Let's also not forget how a bunch of ragtag farmers and hunters cause much trouble for the British about 234 years ago…"

Yeah, except we're not the British from 234 years ago, and these guys today aren't even what those "ragtag farmers" were back then…

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diablotakahe September 27, 2010 at 8:28 pm

go read the equivalent journal to this website circa 1940. you'll hear similar comments about the japs and their ricepaper airplanes, etc etc.

careful.

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blight September 27, 2010 at 10:18 pm

Gonna pop over to lonesentry and see if they have anything of interest then…

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Brenden September 28, 2010 at 12:14 am

I really like the 5th wheel horse trailer with a rocket on it! Where can I get one, that would be quite neat to take to a horse show, I could get some real sales if I replicate it!

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Radar9999 September 28, 2010 at 2:33 am

All this talk of invasion is foolish. Iran is much larger and more geographically diverse, and the there is a larger population to deal with. Their conventional forces are likely to be a joke, however they are very prepared to fight unconventionally to oppose us militarily. The other big issue is that the garden variety Iranian, the baker, the doctor, the mechanic, the merchant, and students like American culture and Americans. They are at odds with their government and conservative religious institutions, but, like us, would band together strongly to oppose anyone setting foot on the homeland. Our issue is with their government and it’s policies. We should keep that in mind and exploit that the promote change in their political system and it’s policies.

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Jimbo September 28, 2010 at 11:47 am

Read somewhere: "You Americans with your Land Warrior systems, advanced radars and death-ray beams… Some time in the future you will be so busy reading all your dials and screens that you don't notice the old caveman-with-giant-club behind you."

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GrumpyOldSoldier September 29, 2010 at 6:25 pm

Laughing at a potential enemy's armament with no clue of what they plan to do with it is a great way to boost the sale of body-bags to DOD.

Some possibilities: the funny little sub could deliver SEAL type troops, or one suicide bomber and a lot of explosives. The ATVs could deliver a lot of infantry to an ambush site, and then be used for extraction afterwards. By the time air support could be called in, they could be so far-scattered and hidden that their losses would be infinitesimal.

For the benefit of the younger, high tech generation; ask your Dad to tell you about pungi pits, or your Granddad how German tanks were taken out by a sock stuffed with TNT and dipped in tar, or even how the Philippians could take out (as in destroy, not just slow or stop them) using logs. All those were silly weapons, but the dead were just as dead as if killed by a shiny new high tech toy.

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GrumpyOldSoldier September 29, 2010 at 6:51 pm

Sorry, typo above. Should have said, "Filipinos could take out TANKS (as in destroy, not just slow or stop them) using logs.

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jhm September 29, 2010 at 9:48 pm

they had armor support too. they were just the vanguard.

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akhilleus October 3, 2010 at 3:57 pm

I think you guys need to stop focusing on the ATVs so much as firing platforms, and more as battle taxis, like HMMWVs before they were press-ganged into doing everything under the sun poorly. I wouldn't mind using that quad to schlep a GPMG and several hundred rounds of linked, along with my AG, several klicks up a pass or other terrain feature. Get set in a likely avenue of approach, coordinate with other a$$holes in the area, go loud and then bug the hell out. It's valid for harrassment and interdiction. I dunno if that's how they'd be employed, but hey….

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Bob October 7, 2010 at 4:44 pm

Yeah … Each time we consider people inferiorly equipped (Vietnam, Korea, Afghanistan…), we end up losing that war [cough] .. negotiating peace.

yeah it looks ridiculous and so what? You only need one hand to kill someone.
So How about we shut the **** up and start repaying our $100T debt?

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Michael Hickman November 19, 2010 at 10:37 am

We NEVER lost Viet Nam – the Viet Con signed a piece treaty. We left, they retaliated AFTER we were gone!! I'm so sick of hear how we lost that war. What we lost was here at home at that was pride and support for our soldiers!

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Michael Hickman November 19, 2010 at 10:39 am

Look at how those weapons are poised. They could only be fired if being chased. They must get chased a lot!!

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Michael Hickman November 19, 2010 at 10:57 am

Hey Bob, either stand behind and support our soldiers, or feel free to stand in front of them.
The Russians lost their asses in Afghanistan, we're still fighting the battle. We never lost Viet Nam, the north signed a peace treaty. Once we were packed and gone, the north renigged on the treaty and attacked the south again! Get your shit straight, or get the hell out!
M.H. CSM
Schoffield, Hawaii
25th Infantry Division
Airborne Ranger
25 years of service!

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Gerry Bin November 19, 2010 at 2:09 pm

Yesterday, it was Iraq and now it is Iran. Strangely, if my country was surrounded by another nation' army, I would want nukes, also. Especially if that opposing occupier force is guilty of using nukes and depleted uranium on non-white enemies in the past. Just a thought.

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Aaron Johnson November 20, 2010 at 8:49 am

The thought of these guys, shooting while moving, 1 the guns are mounted to the rear so they can cover their retreat I'm guessing 2 have you ever tried to shoot from a moving vehicle? it's not as easy as you think! 3 the fact that they have the funding to buy quads for their troops, that should scare you. 4 we need to be sure that they shoot at least as bad as the republican guard, before we tease them.

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SittingMooseShaman June 17, 2011 at 11:09 am

…nice. But can they do…mud?!

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Mohsen35 December 13, 2011 at 6:35 pm

salam.you are afraid becouse we are powerful.because we have GOD and you dont. because we are free and you are free just in sex.because we know evrything is a toy and u dont.because we are 1 + lobnan and u are many but you are losing.because we see everything and you just see what freemasons give u.because of Tabbas.becasue we won in 8 years war when we had nothing.And so many things that your porno clips dont let u to understand.isnt it time to wake up ? isn't it time to have freedom ? isn't it time to have your country ? isn't it time to have God?

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decent plumbers February 11, 2013 at 8:57 pm
Jaz Lai February 20, 2013 at 9:08 am
liam March 24, 2013 at 4:29 pm

If we ever do take on Iran…it'll go some thing like this…"Iran….that was the WORST hour of my life….glad that war is over!!

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STemplar September 25, 2010 at 6:45 am

Creep around the Gulf? Realistically what is the range on Tom Swifts Jetmarine? Like maybe 100 miles? They have to get to where ever they are creeping somehow. I would assume we are paying a wee bit closer attention to that sort of thing since we embarrassed ourselves with the small craft dilemma.

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Maxtrue September 25, 2010 at 10:55 am

David has "issues"…

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blight September 26, 2010 at 9:14 pm

Small is subjective. The United States was small compared to the Soviet Union, and who won?

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 2:45 pm

Ummm we threw both governments out of power and killed vast amounts of their leadership and restricted their operational viability to their own soil?

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Philo September 27, 2010 at 3:27 pm

I was making a joke based off of B.H. Obammy's comment's about iranistan during the elections:

Obama: "Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, these countries are tiny compared to the Soviet Union. They don't pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us…"

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John Smith September 27, 2010 at 3:59 pm

Yes you,did but dont forget the war supposed to be over in 2003!!!!!

OUPS!

Oh and please tell me about the collateral damage as you like to say it!!! How many lives it has cost, and how many more will live suffering?Both "good allies" and "bad mouslim" CIVILIANS!!!

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STemplar September 27, 2010 at 4:01 pm

Nice use of exclamation points by the way, but I am done feeding the troll, tah.

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John Smith September 27, 2010 at 4:04 pm

Just go feed your beloved Bush, you have the same IQ anyway!!

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blight September 27, 2010 at 6:28 pm

Ah, okay. Well, then Obama is demonstrating 3GW thinking where "size matters".

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crackedlenses September 27, 2010 at 7:01 pm

You make him look like a genius, at least he's level-headed, while you seem to forget your guy got elected if I remember correctly….

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crackedlenses September 28, 2010 at 9:54 am

Iranian Rep Guard: Where's my Spartan? I have been praying to Allah for one for years! And how come the Americans aren't afraid of our stupid ATV's? May Allah curse them……

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crackedlenses September 28, 2010 at 9:55 am

*Suit*

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crackedlenses October 5, 2010 at 9:51 am

An Iranian immigrant was telling me how the Iranian protesters were mobbing the soldiers and taking their weapons and gear, don't know how reliable the info was though….

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AlphaDog November 19, 2010 at 10:15 am

Only because our military is not allowed to engage them in the same manner.

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