An Option for Humvee Recap

There are thousands of beat up Humvees heading back from the AO that the Army’s going to need to refit or replace as the service reorganizes its brigade combat team structure to reflect a post-Iraq (and Afghanistan) world.

A fight is brewing on The Hill over which option to embrace and given the delays in the Joint Light Tactical Vehicle and the lack of enthusiasm for MRAPs as an everyday transport or tactical vehicle, it’s clear there’s a future for the Humvee fleet for at least the next decade.

Defense Tech was briefed last week on an option that essentially turns a run-of-the-mill Humvee into a Level I protective MRAP simply by plugging in a specially-designed crew capsule.

The Granite Tactical Vehicle and Textron “Survivable Combat Tactical Vehicle” uses no exotic materials to make it strong enough to withstand an IED blast, but the geometry of the capsule is akin to an MATV or Cougar which allows blast effects to deflect rather than impact the flat surfaces of even a Frag Kit 5 Humvee.

The SCTV has undergone independent and U.S. Marine Corps blast and mobility testing. The independent blast testing confirms the vehicle is capable of protection levels equal to Mine Resistant Ambush Protection (MRAP) level 1 specifications. While providing unparalleled protection, the SCTV’s mobility and performance exceed currently fielded HMMWVs by reducing overall weight and integrating upgraded suspension and engine technology.

Granite president, retired SEAL Chris Berman, said while the Corps tests showed the SCTV could withstand any blast thrown at it (three of six capsules sent for testing were blown up), the durability tests fell short since the Humvees used didn’t have upgraded suspension. But with a tweaked engine and suspension, the SCTV can deliver better performance than an uparmored Humvee, he said.

It’s unclear which way the services will go with their recap — a more exotic vented DARPA solution or simply an M1115 refit — but the forces are aligning for quite a fight for the fiscal pie.

— Christian

13 Comments on "An Option for Humvee Recap"

  1. This Hum-Vee-Hull upgrade looks like a dynamite program. Using existing vehicles (plus spares, plus support, plus training) is a sure winner on the budgetary front.
    Just hope it will live up to its MRAP Level-1 goal – that's one area that accepts no compromises.

  2. Wishful thinking and cost cutting are going to get people killed and maimed.

  3. Humvee is a fine transport vehicle just the way it is (without the up armor), they just need a better light tactical vehicles for combat duties. Its that simple.

  4. My concern with bolt on options, upgrade, etc of the HMMWV is that it will always weigh more than a vehicle designed from the ground up for the role their trying to adapt it to. With the general overweight condition of the ground forces this is the sort of thing that will come to haunt us later and drive some other developement effort. Its an option between being purely reactionary or proactive in producing a multi-role vehicle with significant combat survivability.

  5. Byron Skinner | March 1, 2011 at 2:57 pm | Reply

    Good Morning Folks,

    What is missing here of course is the costs of refurbishing existing vehicles to the new standard (M-1115). Which is cheaper, buying a new vehicle or converting the old?

    Two issues here I think are important for consideration. First is the tactical need of armored wheeled vehicles and what are the optimum trade offs. The MRAP's in all variants have been somewhat less then billed as in their armored protection and in many units provided somewhat less protection (statistically) to the EFP's and IED's the the up-armored HUMVEE.

    The HUMVEE's size and off road abilities and cost makes it so far the ideal vehicle for use in urban combat which appears to have be a consideration for current and future ground forces needs. MRAPs are to heavy for surfaced roads and bridges and limited off road abilities, the Stryker, well it has it's own set of unique problems that disqualifies it for any consideration here. In short the ground forces need a vehicle like the HUMVEE.

    The second and perhaps the largest cost savings consideration is to purchase a relative cheap, none armored vehicle for garrison used. The HUMVEE is to large and to expensive for taking Company Commanders at Ft. Hood over to Battalion HQ for a meeting. Something along the size lines of the old M-151A1, only build to current road safety standards, would seem to fit this requirement.

    Byron Skinner

  6. Just get rid of them all!! The Humvee is a joke and a trap………wake up and get them out of here!!!!!!

  7. Considering how badly a procurement system we have, (just look at the Marines Expeditionary Vehicle story on this site) the devil we know may be better.
    I am not saying we should not move forward with a new vehicle.
    But until that new vehicle is in production for years, we will have to rely on the Humvee. It is better if we upgrade the Humvee while this process goes forward.

  8. Here's an idea. Why dont they sell the ones coming back to civi's….willing to pay good money for them, instead of shredding and scrapping them!

    The carbon counters can go pound sand. This policy is another another waste of money.

  9. It doesn't matter how big, bad or well protected you make a vehicle, the bad guys will just use bigger bombs or simul-detonated EFPs. A remote controlled unmanned something sounds good, or something that detaches and rolls away from the blast for the personnel carriers. Deflecting the blast only works part of the time as seams can be split. I'm not smart enough to design anything though.

    We still need an in-garrison vehicle. HMMWVs should only be used in garrison. Period. Refurb to that.

    I agree w/some on the refurb HMMWVs. It might be cheaper to melt down the relics coming back instead of refurbishing them. Some cost-benefit analysis should already have been done.

  10. I was in Theatre and assisting with the oversight for the Frag 5 upgrades back in 2006/7. Being from the automotive world the bigger problems that soldiers experienced with the vehicles was the inability for the vehicle not being able to handle the weight. The engine, tranny and platform were just not created to sustain such a heavy load of armor and were basically fundemental components that can be found on civilian vehicles. I found it amazing that those vehicles worked as well as they did after we put on the Frag 5s which includes the wear and tear the soldiers put on also because of their job requirements. I would not replace the MRAP/MATV with the HMMVVE but I would use this vehicle in situations necessary. Each vehicle has its functions and abilities; one size does NOT fit all. That is why we have multiple platforms in the cilvilian world so we can accomodate multiple uses for various situations.

  11. Perhaps there is a winner among the JLTV contenders, I don't know for sure. Yet if JLTV isn't shaping up to be the vehicle we need, this is certainly an alternative to consider.

  12. HMMWV High Output Engine Upgrade
    An improved and redesigned HMMWV engine based on the OEM HMMWV 6.5L that will drop-in and bolt-up to any HMMWV with no modification to the vehicle. Custom horsepower and torque range tailored to any unique application, terrain and operating environment. Up to 79% increase in horsepower and up to 60% increase in torque over the standard OEM HMMWV.

  13. HMMWV High Output Engine Upgrade
    An improved and redesigned HMMWV engine based on the OEM HMMWV 6.5L that will drop-in and bolt-up to any HMMWV with no modification to the vehicle. Custom horsepower and torque range tailored to any unique application, terrain and operating environment. Up to 79% increase in horsepower and up to 60% increase in torque over the standard OEM HMMWV.

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