So the Syrian government, has been unable to break the back of a populist uprising using snipers, RPGs, tanks and aircraft has turned to lobbing massive 240 mm mortars into the city of Homs, killing dozens. This sounds like an old fashioned leave no one alive siege. In case there were any doubts, this shows that the Syrian dictatorship of Bashar al Assad is at war with his own people.
Syrian troops are firing Soviet-made M240 breech loading mortars into the city. These fire the largest mortar rounds in the world, according to the Christian Science Monitor. To put things in perspective, the 240 mm mortar rounds are roughly five-feet long. The Soviets used them in Afghanistan and the Russian army used the weapons to bombard the city of Grozny during its wars in Chechnya. So while they were designed to hit enemy bunkers from long ranges, they’ve also been used to bludgeon civilian population centers.
The mortars can either be towed or carried aboard the purpose made tracked vehicle called the Tulip. Nice huh?
Click through the jump to see a video of the Tulip in action.
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Eventually he is going to kill enough people that he wont have anybody to rule.
i hope turkey invades Syria and chop this coward balls
They have to rise up for themselves just like Libya, we can’t open a war against any dictator, Iran is enough
Don't forget we also helped the Libyans overthrow Gaddafi. The Syrian people are already rising up against Assad I think it's time we stop dancing around this subject and instead start helping them.
No UNSC resolution, there is no way this President in an election year is going to lead the charge for a military option. The phrase "coalition of the willing" was already mentioned on one news piece l saw and that just feeds into too many attack ads during the election and easy openings in a debate.
This might sound callous but just out of curiosity, are there any european countries invested in Syria for oil?
Cause the Europeans were all over a civil war in libya. Yet slaughtering unarmed civilians they don’t seem to care to much about.
Or maybe the reports of france and england running out of bombs were true and they don’t have any munitions left to step in with.
No, the US supports dictators as long as they follow orders from Washington, and murders/overthrows democratically elected leaders if they oppose US policies.
Recent history is filled with examples. You just need to read it.
I don't think anyone is going to deny that?
interesting stuff here:
http://www.todayszaman.com/news-271843-turkey-den…
Interesting "bell" ring sound these make when firing.
That'll show those terrorists and armed gangs.
I suspect that resorting to using armored tracked artillery shows that the Syrian army is not having success with lesser weapons. This may be due to "those terrorists and armed gangs" having access to some decent firepower of their own, either through defection or foreign supply.
It's cheaper than sending in infantry troops to fight it out house to house.
I love the sabot tied on with string in the video, good ole dependable Russian technology right there.
That appears to be a booster charge, what our mortar guys called a "cheese charge."
A mortar round is caseless, with a comparatively small amount of self-contained propellant expended directly against the base-plate, and thus it acts more like a rocket than a two-part artillery shell. This keeps tube pressure much lower, allowing much lighter tube construction, and hence greater portability.
The down side is that you get less range, and insufficient projectile velocity for effective direct fire. The striking power is mainly the explosive in the bomb.
In this situation, how do you differentiate between Mortar and Artillery Shell? Just curious?
I'd imagine this pig can drop that engine block of a munition much closer than a similar sized Howitzer could .
Trajectory maybe? Not sure how else you differentiate.
The description of this whole contraption makes it sound more like a gun you off load before firing….
The main difference is the location of the trunnions (the bearings that enable the barrel to alter its elevation) relative to the breech. Howitzers/cannon have trunnions in front of the breech, roughly at the center of gravity of the barrel assembly. Mortars have the trunnions behind the breech.
It's also possible to distinguish based upon whether the projectile incorporates the propellant in the design – i.e. there is no separate propellant charge (either in a separately loaded bag, or a brass cartridge)
Field guns & howitzers have rifled barrels. The great majority of mortars have smooth barrels, inc. the M240. Major exceptions are the French MO-120 RT-61 recently adopted by the USMC as the M327 & the old American 4.2 inch still in use around the world.
Lots of things are different besides the previous answers. Cannons are for Direct fire (low angle) and motars fire high angle and shorter range. This allows for their use against targets hidden behind hills buildings etc.
Bad answer. Artillery cannons rarely fire direct fire. Also, low angle doesn't refer to direct fire. Indirect fire refers to the inability to observe, aim, and fire in three steps. When a FO is used, and calculations are made to determine angle to target, etc., that is considered indirect fire, which accounts for 99% of Field Artillery (cannon) missions.
Sometimes I wish I lived in Soviet Russia so all my military systems & inventions I designed as a kid would actually materialize.
But with my childhood behind me, I just don't see how this is better than having smaller mortars and equal/bigger artillery. Ammo transportation/loading seems like a pain.
I guess it's only practical for what Syria is using it for – urban civilians/uprisings. I guess that's why russia sent it to syria.
Tell me they don't have a Willie Pete round for that monster! That would be serious hell in an urban environment.
According to the 2010-2011 edition of Jane's Ammunition Handbook, the Russians developed the standard HE shell, an extended range rocket-assisted HE, a laser-guided HE, a cargo bomb with 24 HE bomblets and, in case you really need to make an impression, a tactical nuke shell with a 2 kT yield. No WP bomb, though, so you can sleep easily again :-)
Regards & all,
Thomas L. Nielsen
Luxembourg
So Um….. don't you think he would eventually use gas which is one of the reasons we went into Iraq. So I THINK we eventually have to go in and stop them.
Chemical warfare is a whole different animal right now it is bombs and bullets people are kind of sensitized to that sort of violence. But if the chem genie is let out of the bottle every nation will demand the regimes ouster and be willing to fight for it.
I doubt they would use it. The problem is there are sectarian divides in every city. Saw footage of the border between neighborhoods in Homs, across the street was an Alawite neighborhood. It would be very hard to use them and not kill your own supporters. They are a pain in the ass to deploy and create nothing but headaches for the Syrian Army, after all, what do you do with wind shifts?
Chem weapons are area denial weapons, not terribly good offensively. To say nothing of that would make it too easy for the world to green light military action, UN or no UN.
Chemical weapons are almost worthless. HE > silly gas everytime.
Where is the Syrian Air Force, don't they still have something left that can fly?
Waiting to take over the country after someone shoves a JDAM up Assad ass.
In WW2, Soviet propaganda made a point of saying, "Every second German soldier has an Iron Cross, but every second Soviet soldier has a mortar!". Good point, considering that in modern times artillery has killed more infantry than any other weapon.
Did I hear it right in that video, the commentator called Chechens "bandits"?
"Did I hear it right in that video, the commentator called Chechens "bandits"?"
Do you prefer to call them "freedom fighters"?
Once you read Inside the Soviet Army, you develop a grim appreciation for Soviet artillery doctrine. And as someone else said, big guns never tire…
For perspective, the American military used to have (203mm?) 8" artillery pieces (the M110) for heavy artillery. And as an aside, it used be the family of M108 (105mm), M109 (155mm), M110 (203mm).
As was evidenced by the second assault on Grozny: slow moving extremely heavy preparation fire, advancing street by street.
Versus the first war, which was tank blitz into downtown against a defense force with a nucleus of ex-Soviet soldiers and stockpiles of Soviet military hardware. The Chechens were predominately nationalists the first go-round until displaced by the Islamists later on.
Since this whole uprising is supported by AL Qaeda and is lead by the Islamic Brotherhood I prefer to see this uprising go away. Al Assad is a creep and dictator but isn't a Islamist like the groups wanting to kill him and take over.
Mortar system is cool but looks dated. However as mobile light artillery looks cool.
Actually, none of the Arab Spring uprisings were organized or led by Islamists. The social dynamics at play are much, much more complex.
IMHO, at least in the case of Egypt, old man Malthus was at play. But revolutions may be started and finished by different people. Case in point, Russia.
Karl, Lance's point was that religious fanatics are taking over from secular dictators. While the Muslim Brotherhood did not start the protests in Egypt and Al-Qaeda didn't start the revolt in Libya it's clear both got involved quickly and profited immensely. Check the election results from Egypt.
"Social dynamics" in Libya, Egypt, and now Syria are shaping up as old dictator of the not so religious sort replaced by younger more fanatic islamists. That is something to be concerned about.
Correct. The Shah was taken down by a mix of secular and religious leaders (and event left-wing commies). The religious ones terminated their former allies.
Yeah it kind of puts those silly "best rifle" flame wars into perspective. I wonder what was the last war where firearms produced the most casualties?
Spanish War of succession. Then some spoilsport called Shrapnel went and invented something called a 'canister shell' and it was all downhill from there.
Those who cheer for the freedom fighters of Bumrootistan ought to take pause, and reflect on the fact that revolutions are often precipitated by foreign policy failures. Russia had been all but defeated in WWI. French ambitions had been checked by the British at every turn. Failures on the international front may not be main reason, but when it's at least one of the reasons, the new government may be a revanchist one. After all, the first thing the French did after the Revolution was declare war on Britain. The new Egyption government is far more hostile to Israel than Mubarak ever was.
You're right. The American Revolution should have been stopped right away. Look where that led to!
What does it have in common with Syria and Egypt?
An uprising of the people against an unwanted, undemocratic regime. Why deny them what you're proud of yourself?
Sorry Carl not all the rebels are Islamist. BUT the moments leader are hard line Islamist. Case in Egypt and Libya which now Taliban like governments are forming. and in Syria Al Qaeda has approved and aids the rebels sorry but the Arab spring isn't bringing democracy more theocracy.
Egypt? Lybia? Taliban-like? Say what?
Besides, what's wrong with a little religion in politics? Isn't that exactly what people like Santorum want?
Silly comparison.
Nobody can imagine how far the religious right would go, being as the bill of rights prevents the use of a Guardian Council or Saudi Arabian religious police. They're just envelope-pushing.
No, but people don't have to imagine to see how far off track the "religious left" has taken us. All they have to do is look around them. Abortion extremism, environmental extremism, over regulation, and a litany of unintended consequences. In fact leftist fiscal and political philosophy is the main driver of our current economic struggles.
We have been living in the religion of the left since the 1930s when progressivism promised to transform the nation. Turns out the transformation was based on an equation of failed principles that it has taken us 80 years to figure out, and that transformation was to something less than our former self.
Credit due to Obama for what again? Destabilizing the middle east? We have a bogus "R2P" "kinetic action" in Lybia but when the conditions are much worse in Syria, we balk. Talk about leadership.
Does the "R2P" doctrine only apply to African states? Why? Why did Valerie Jarrett push Obama so hard for the war in Lybia? Why are the democrat war-mongers now silent on Lybia when their hypocracy has been fully exposed?
"Give Obama credit"… please… people like you are a freaking joke. swallowing it whole and regurgitating it whole.
Edit: Why are the democrat war mongers silent on Syria* (not Lybia)
Matt, you dont belong here, this is for people that know what they are talking about. This is an article on a freakin mortar system, you are proving you're own extremism…..you brought up abortion LOL….
Go onto Fox or something and post your bile there. Im a centrist by the way, and its people like you that push everyone to the left, good job captain america.
Really? I believe you were the one pointlessly towing the line for the administration and media, "giving Obama credit" out of nowhere for the colossal failure of his foreign policy.
I dont watch Fox. You brought up Obama the Great ™ and of course you dont answer or attempt to answer any of my questions.
BTW Brad, you are not a centrist, you are obviously a leftist. No one is fooled. Leftists love to call themselves "centrists" in a benign attempt to constantly move the baseline further left.
It was obvious when you interjected YOUR POLITICS into this thread to begin with.
I love the Arab Spring: the violent, extremist, unemployed, distraught, archaic, hopeless young men of the middle east are turning their hatred they learned so well from their masters, to their masters themselves. Was there ever a question the middle east was going to implode? The only question was "when?". When you cultivate terror and extremism and hatred internally and project those things out on to an external boogey-man (US, Israel, etc) eventually things boil over at home when people realize the boogey-man invented rock and roll and facebook and they like to watch the boogey man's movies and watch his porn.
The world is too small now for these dictators to blame some far off land for their people's state as they are living in 8 mansions and have golden cars. Hadji can get on google and see freedom all across the world and contrast it with his failed hard-socialist state.
In the words of our POTUS' spirtual mentor "Syria's chickens have come home to roost."
Agree, but "Hadji can get on google and see freedom all across the world and contrast"
You mean some of the people want freedom and rock n roll. The Hadji types wants to take over the old secular dictatorships and replace with a new muslim dictatorships and ban rock n roll. We need some way to identify and support the genuine freedom fighters and avoid arming and helping the Hadji ones.
I didn't think this was something that needed to be pointed out, but not everyone in the Middle East is a terrorist.
Yeah, but they're the ones happy to live in peace, no matter which crazy bastards are ambitious enough to get to the top; be they general or islamic revolutionary.
the vast majority of Americans don't have a clue about this basic fact – Israeli soldiers have been arbitrarily evicting, beating, torturing, and murdering helpless Palestinians (even women and children) with the backing of the US (due to a powerful Jewish lobby) ever since the founding of the state of Israel.
Most citizens of other countries knew it – India, Russia, China, all countries in the Middle East (obviously), even Britain and Canada.
But most Americans simply don't have a clue. WHY? Well, who owns the media? Who owns the US politicians??
Anyone who has actually spent some time reading about the dirty deeds of the UK and the US in the Middle East (along with Israel) would have little difficulty understanding the so-called "terrorists" are simply civilians seeking revenge for the murder of their parents, children, wife, husband etc at the hands of well-armed soldiers from Israel, the UK, and the US.
One has to give credit to the US media for doing such an excellent job brainwashing the Americans.
speaking of terrorists, I challenge the "patriots" to google "USS Liberty" and find out what happened, why the incident had been covered up, and why the those responsible for the incident (including the country) were allowed to get away free.
I took you up on your challenge.
The 6th fleet ordered the Liberty to leave the war zone, but the order was lost in the new computerized communications routing system (same system that did not route the signals from the USS Pueblo in 68 until it was too late).
The Israelis asked the 6th fleet command and we told them all of our ships were clear of the area. Which 6th fleet thought was true since they had ordered such.
Then Israeli ground forces were shelled by an Egyptian ship near El Arish, and scrambled fighters to attack the ship. They found the Liberty instead, unfortunately.
After the event Israel apologized and compensated our sailors. It's the least they could do.
To compare: Terrorists target civilians on purpose, and they don't apologize and pay compensation.
You are a liar "passingby".
The Liberty was flying an American flag, and if I remember correctly was overflown before it was engaged.
your lie is way too lame and stupid to merit a serious rebuttal.
You know, maybe we should intervene after all. Not an all-out campaign of regime change, just something to take out Assad's heavy weapons, just to limit civilian casualties in the meantime while the international community decides what to do with Assad. Then again, Libya started out as this and ended up being regime change anyway….
Assad supports womens rights to get married and then on a whim, divorce and get huge money from her husband. We do not want that. Better is three pieces of silver as said in Shariah Law.
O Regime está caindo. Armas nenhuma conseguirão parar o ímpeto da revolução. Viva os Mártires, Viva o FSA.
A Rússia pagará caro pelo seu apoio a um Louco no Poder. A Rússia e a China passarão para a história como os grandes defensores de assassinos de inocentes.
Syria doesn't have much oil
Syria is one of the few countries on the Arabian peninsula with very little in the way of oil reserves. Within the next few years they will be importing more oil than they produce.
Indeed,
"blood for oil" is only wrong when Americans do it. Europeans are allowed, obviously.
The Libya-Italy pipeline is flowing again. Europe bought from Iraq under Saddam and buys from Iran.
How much Iraqi oil are we buying? I guess Americans are not very good at "blood for oil" business anyway.
Oh. That explains all
Learn your geography not on the Arabian peninsula its south of Turkey on the Med.
Kind of curious how that works out; considering our lack of accessibility to Syria. We're not air dropping pallets of guns; the FSA doesn't own an airport where supplies can be delivered to. The Syrian military probably would nail one and crow victory.
27th February, 2012
On 13 February 2012, Thierry Meyssan revealed on the first Russian television channel that Syria had captured a dozen French soldiers. Voltaire Network is now in a position to confirm that as of 26 February the number of French prisoners is 18 (eighteen).
If Paris admits that they were on a mission, they will be entitled to prisoner-of-war status and protected by the relative Geneva Convention; but if Paris denies having sent them, they will be considered as foreign civilians and judged in Syria for their crimes, which are punishable by the death penalty.
France has opened three negotiation channels via the Russian Federation, the United Arab Emirates and the Sultanate of Oman.
The ambassador of France, Eric Chevallier, returned urgently to Damascus on 23 February.
Kofi Annan has been appointed as the joint United Nations-Arab League envoy on the Syrian crisis.
Aware of the potential use it can make of the captives in the midst of the French electoral campaign, Damascus called on Syrian state media not to raise the matter at this time. It thus reserves the possibility of dealing with it under the radar if this option proves to be more advantageous. While acknowledging the uniqueness of this situation, the Syrian journalists, who were quick to adapted to the freedom of expression guaranteed by the new media law, growled that limits are again being imposed for reasons of national security.
If negotiations are kept secret, France will have to quietly pay very heavy war indemnities, either in cash or by way of economic privileges. If they are made public, France can hope to reduce the bill, but Nicolas Sarkozy and Alain Juppe will have some explaining to do to their fellow citizens. Their political camp would compromise its chances of winning the presidential election, with the president even risking to be brought before the High Court (Articles 35 and 68 of the Constitution).
In the Rainbow Warrior affair (1985), where there was a sunken ship and one person killed, France had formally apologized and had paid a compensation of $ 7 million to New Zealand and $ 8.16 million to Greenpeace. Above all, Paris had to consent to the importation of sheep of New Zealand partially destroying its own sheep industry. In exchange, the two detained French agents were released. Ironically, Laurent Fabius, the Prime Minister whose government had ordered the attack on the Rainbow Warrior, is tipped to become foreign minister if the Socialist candidate, François Hollande, becomes the next president of France. The latter happens to be former brother-in-law of Lt. Col. Gerard Royal, who commanded the operation.
In the secret war against Syria, France and its allies are responsible for a conflict that caused the death of at least 3,000 Syrian soldiers and 1,500 civilians, plus economic losses and the sabotage of infrastructure estimated at least $ 3 billion.
http://inthesenewtimes.com/2012/02/27/france-open…
http://rt.com/news/britain-qatar-troops-syria-893…
British and Qatari troops are directing rebel ammunition deliveries and tactics in the bloody battle for Homs, according to an Israeli website known for links to intelligence sources.
Four centers of operation have been established in the city with the troops on the ground paving the way for an undercover Turkish military incursion into Syria.
The debkafile site said the presence of British and Qatari troops in Homs topped the agenda of Tuesday’s talks between Assad’s officials and head of Russia’s Foreign Intelligence Service Mikhail Fradkov.
Qatar makes little secret of supporting the Syrian opposition with cash, arms and political support. Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani said in mid-January he is ready to send troops to Syria to stop the violence there. Britain insists it is not planning any military action against the Assad regime.
The scenario painted by the report closely resembles Libya’s collapse into anarchy. UN Security Council resolution 1973 forbade any ground troops from intervening in Libya while creating a pretext for NATO to launch a bombing campaign against Muammar Gaddafi’s troops.
However Qatar, Britain and France later confirmed they had sent units to assist the Libyan rebels. Secret French weapons drops were discovered after they fell into the wrong hands. There were also unconfirmed reports that Western special forces directed air strikes from forward frontline positions and directed combat tactics.
The Pentagon and its allies have proposed the creation of a humanitarian corridor in Syria with a view to delivering supplies and humanitarian aid to Syrian civilians. However, critics have cast doubts on the plans, likening them to the no-fly zone in Libya which preceded military intervention in the country.
Commenting on the US’s proposal for the creation of a “humanitarian corridor,” journalist Carla Stea told RT its “opening could easily become distorted and used for other purposes.”
The Libya example was cited by Russia and China when they vetoed a draft UN Security Council resolution on Syria last Saturday. Britain, France & the US, who backed the resolution lashed out at Moscow and Beijing, accusing them of siding with a regime that had ‘blood on its hands’.
Ali Rizk, a Middle East expert talking live to RT from Beirut, described the UK and Qatari intervention as a sign of “how desperate the anti-Assad forces have become.”
“After the Russian veto dealt a severe blow to their agenda, now they are in a state of desperation where they’ll probably stop at nothing to try and regain the momentum again”, said Rizk.
He then linked the refusal of pockets of the opposition forces to negotiate unless Assad falls as part of a Western agenda to remove a political obstacle to their interests in the region.
“For the West it’s not about negotiations; it’s about overthrowing a regime which is part of a border block which Western powers want to get rid of.”
“The political stance is that if we overwhelm Assad we’ve dealt a severe blow to Iran’s presence and Hezbollah, two of Israel’s staunch enemies.”
I find it interesting that you describe Roe v Wade as "abortion extremism". As for environmental extremism, without some regulatory framework there's little incentive for companies to clean up waste products, though the compromise-hobbled EPA of today cannot guarantee anything either.
People still point to the heyday of America as either Reagan or Clinton depending on ideology. We have ascended quite nicely from the '30s through a succession of liberal and conservative presidents; and if Keynesianism failed us in the great depression America would have been a failed state much sooner.
Thanks for the tidbit. I might never have caught this.
Feels like the Cold War never ended. Good ol' Secret Team hard at work.
"they stop buying that product until the manufacturer adresses the grievances"
For example, people are disappointed with the handling of the Deepwater horizon spill. How can fishermen on the gulf "punish" Transocean? Or Halliburton? Maybe you can "punish" BP by not buying gas from their gas stations, but it's somewhat unfair to BP, and BP probably sells petroleum to other refineries where it then disappears into the "oil supply".
And wall street. How does one express displeasure at the bailouts. Withdraw money and hide it under our pillows? Go to credit unions? Many people already have. Didn't make a blip of a difference, though I suppose in a true free market we would have let those banks fail. The meltdown happened or was beginning to happen near the end of Bush Jr and the beginning of the Obama administration, and Obama took a lot of Bush's footballs and ran with them.
Whatever people say about small governments on both sides, most people are rarely against them. As long as behemoth Social Security and Medicare don't come down, people are for big government but refuse to acknowledge it.
Two British Secret Air Service Men captured by Syria
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-178728/Sy…
In the meantime, we are all talking about Romney in the Michigan primary. /eyeroll
Just out of curiosity: What is the "British Secret Air Service"?
Regards & all,
Thomas L. Nielsen
Luxembourg
Update: this article isn't dated on dailymail, but perhaps dates to about mar 2011.
i dont know what are you talking about, its clear as the sun, bashar is a murderer and he will eventually end up like the Ghadfi, it will take longer but he will end up the same way
I guess you've been brainwashed beyond salvage.
You don't have a clue what you are talking about. All you can do is regurgitating propaganda you've been fed.
sad.
no surprise there – the establishment owns all the national news networks.
notice how they have marginalized Ron Paul.
Mitt Romney is a scum but seems to be the chosen one on the republican side with scums Santorum and Newt Gingrich as backup.
We'll see who the establishment picks on the democrats side. I'll bet that Kucinich will be marginalized by the mainstream media using the same script for Ron Paul.
Perhaps they are being infiltrated or converted by priests from the Roman Catholic Church (US, Vatican …)
Which countries have the best photographers, models, and the print press???
meant to say … the printing press.
my nick for British Special Air Service when it's operating illegal / illegitimate / mafia-like operations (i.e. against international law, like sabotage / drug trafficking operations frequently done by the Mossad, CIA and MI6) .
damn me – meant to say … when it's undertaking illegal / … operations …
Matt, agreed, but wrt "Nobody put a gun to anyones head." you are wrong.
blight's point was two fold:
1. big corporations get our money one way or another, since we have to buy products to live
2. politicians take our money and use it to bail out their friends (who then give money to politicians to fund their reelection campaigns). How can we express dipleasure? We cannot withdraw our money from the IRS!
Vote for other people? incumbents have the power of money, districting, and primary clout. incumbents almost always win.
wrt financial "investments" the game is totally rigged in favor of big business and big government. the US is only a good investment compared to Europe and China, which have even worse problems
exactly. and ship was unarmed. the attack wasn't preceded by any warning.
US crew on board were waving to the Israeli pilots during the first fly-by
this Jay guy is simply pathetic
http://usslibertyveterans.org/
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/usslibe…
http://www.rense.com/general39/pilot.htm
**** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRZSzdQuOqM **** (Watch this video. Compare LBJ's order to withdraw air support to Dick Cheney's order to stand down during 9-11. Cheney had unprecedentedly wrested control from military command on that particular day – what a coincidence??!!!!!!! )
The Egyptian Navy in its numerous small wars with Israel, to my knowledge did not use false flag tactics. They sank the first Eilat with AShM missiles fair and square. No trickery required.
Reading the official history from the israelis now. http://thelibertyincident.com/docs/israeli/IDF-hi…
Apparently it was detected, overflown and recognized at 6-9AM as an unknown, then a neutral, then the GTR-5 gave it away as the Liberty.
After rumored shellings, three torpedo boats were dispatched. They determined the speed of a vessel to be 28 kt and assumed it was a combat vessel. Apparently, it was measured by two different vessels, even though the Liberty cannot make that speed. And the ROE suggested that vessels going over 20 kt probably were military vessels.
Since the Liberty had been taken off the CIC and position unknown, and this new vessel was apparently going at a high enough speed to justify engagement, the dice was cast.
Wikipedia suggests that "The fact that the ship had Latin markings led Chief of Staff Rabin to fear that the ship was Soviet. Though Egyptian warships were known to disguise their identities with Western markings, they usually displayed Arabic letters and numbers only."
It's beyond Egypt to fly an American flag, sailing a ship the size and sophistication of a US intelligence vessel.
It's NOT beyond Israel, a internationally known expert in false flag operations (in the same league as the UK and the US) to use unmarked fighter jets in an attempt blame the attack on Egypt and drag the US deep into the conflict on the Israeli side. With or without the USS Liberty incident, Israel has succeeded beyond all expectations.
What happened happened. Just because you don't have sufficient IQ to think of a justification does not, cannot, will not negate what actually happened.
Don't BS about why. LEARN about what actually happened first.
You are nowhere close to having reached the stage of being able to talk about the "why"s yet.
And please drop the childish, ignorant farce about "leftist", "rightist", "centrist" labels. You don't know what they actually mean.
Our sources are West Texas intermed, Canadian shale, Nigerian and Venezuelan and Brent for the east coast. Europe's sources are Brent in the north, Libya to the south, perhaps Nigeria and the MidEast. Asia's sources are Brunei/Indonesia other local sources and the Mideast.
STOP making up your own facts, conjectures, and nonsensical theories.
READ about what actually happened.
You are BS'ing about things that are simply irrelevant to what ACTUALLY HAPPENED in the USS Liberty incident and logical inferences that must follow from the facts.