Home » Air » B-52s Ignore China No-Fly Zone

B-52s Ignore China No-Fly Zone

by Richard Sisk on November 26, 2013

B-52 successfully tests alternative jet engine fuelTwo B-52 bombers flew unarmed and unescorted through a no-fly zone declared by China over disputed islands in the East China Sea Monday in a direct challenge by the U.S. to Beijing’s attempts to intimidate its neighbors, defense officials said Tuesday.

The overflight came less than 48 hours after Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel said that the U.S. would not recognize China’s “Air Defense Identification Zone” over the uninhabited Senkaku Islands, claimed by Japan, China and Taiwan.

A Pentagon spokesman, who spoke on condition of anonymity, confirmed that U.S. aircraft flying out of Guam had carried out the overflight on a previously scheduled training mission and returned to Andersen Air Base on Guam “without incident.”

The spokesman would not identify the type of aircraft but other officials said they were B-52H Stratofortresses. In August, B-52s from the 20th Bomber Squadron at Barksdale Air Force Base, La., deployed to Guam as part of the U.S. effort to re-balance forces to the Pacific.

An Air Force press release in August quoted Lt. Col. Scott Maytan, commander of the 20th Bomber Squadron, as stating that “What we do day to day with this presence mission is show our ability to fly our airplanes around the Pacific theater and support whatever contingencies we might be asked to do.”

Maytan added that “The continuous bomber presence maintains long-range strike capability in theater, so our national decision makers have assets that they can use should they ever need to.”

On Friday, China declared the imposition of the Identification Zone over the Senkakus, called Diaoyu by the Chinese, and warned that all aircraft approaching the area must first file a flight plan, radio frequencies and transponder information or risk “emergency military measures.”

The Pentagon spokesman said that the U.S. aircraft did not notify the Chinese on the Senkakus overflight, nor were the U.S. aircraft contacted by the Chinese.

Over weekend, Hagel said in a statement that the Senkakus announcement by China “will not in any way change how the United States conducts military operations in the region. “

Hagel said “We view this development as a destabilizing attempt to alter the status quo in the region. This unilateral action increases the risk of misunderstanding and miscalculations.”

In California, where President Obama was traveling Tuesday, White House officials called for a peaceful settlement of the disputes over the Senkakus and other islands in the region.

“We believe that inflammatory rhetoric and inflammatory policy pronouncements like those made by the Chinese over the weekend are counterproductive, and we believe that those differences of opinion can and should be resolved diplomatically,” said Prinicipal Deputy White House spokesman Josh Earnest.

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{ 162 comments }

PhilAF2013 November 26, 2013 at 5:58 pm

Maybe they were escorted by F-22s that is why the chinese air force didnt even bother to have radio contact with them

Mr.T November 26, 2013 at 7:20 pm

LOL , go change you diapers

tiger November 28, 2013 at 10:07 am

There was no need. The damn planes track on radar for miles.

Andrew November 28, 2013 at 6:19 pm

probably Chinese radio components! Ouch!

Uranium238 December 2, 2013 at 3:03 pm

I agree too. Nobody really knows unless they were actually there at the moment. I see all the F-22 haters are on here hitting the dislike button on every Raptor comment like a lab test with a mouse, cheese and a button.

Paul November 26, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Every time an American buys something at Walmart they are funding Chinese expansion. Something to think about…..

qianlong November 26, 2013 at 7:50 pm

really? the only people getting rich are wallmart stockholders, paying Chinese factories to make something for $3 and then sell it for $30.

blight_ November 26, 2013 at 8:27 pm

You've got it. American workers=poorer. Chinese workers=employed. Big man at the top in America=richer.

IKnowIT November 26, 2013 at 11:00 pm

The Chinese need us as much as we need them.

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 9:56 am

Hell yeah, I know if I had a big factory that could make machine tools, I'd be highly dependent on some dead beat customer that had nothing but debt.

oblatt2 November 27, 2013 at 9:16 am

Yes what is happening is classic industrial disruption. The Chinese are working up the value chain from the bottom. But US companies can still survive by charging a premium for the marketing and distribution at the end of the chain.

That is how it is possible that the Chinese can own 90% of the value chain and still have American companies taking 50% of the profits.

But of course it all ends when the Chinese make the small step into sales and marketing. Suddenly the whole industry flips and everything is Chinese. What Americans thought was 50% ownership – because we were taking 50% of the profits – collapses to zero. It doesn't even make sense to setup an American competitor anymore because everything is Chinese controlled.

We have already seen it in several American industries. Its also the way the American consumer electronics industry watched as the Japanese took everything from them.

Andrew November 28, 2013 at 6:16 pm

you are so right._, does anybody get that!! short term gain for long time problems!_

Jaro November 30, 2013 at 5:43 am

And they are buying in a fashion don't they? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOshw4kIGR4&fe
Animal behaviour.

andy November 26, 2013 at 6:53 pm

I wonder if the Chinese shot down the B52, do we ask "Please return our plane"?

Paul Allen November 26, 2013 at 7:15 pm

Bush did

andy November 26, 2013 at 8:28 pm

no, Obama did….he ask for Iran to return our drone

FormerDirtDart November 26, 2013 at 8:54 pm

Yes, Bush did, in April 2001. The Hainan Island incident. Chinese J-8 collided with a Navy P-3. P-3 made an emergency landing on Hainan Island. The crew was only returned after a letter from the State Department was delivered, stating the US was sorry for the death of the Chinese pilot, and for entering Chinese airspace, and landing without permission.

ifDog December 2, 2013 at 9:54 am

…and the Chinese returned it to us disassembled and in a crate. Anyone ever know what happened to that aircraft? Did we ever bother reassembling it and returning it to service, or was it retired (stored, used for parts, scrapped, etc.)?

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:20 am

Hmmmm. China might return favor one of these days by shooting a few dozen machine gun rounds into the B-52 or EP-3 and then ask the US to return the bullets.

mpower6428 November 26, 2013 at 8:57 pm

With or without a signed letter of apology for our imperialist transgression…?

because bush did….

blight_ December 2, 2013 at 1:01 pm

If you told people that the Chinese got their hands on an EP-3, I wonder if the instinctual reflex is to blame Clinton or Obama.

S- happens, and it happens to every president.

Washington was the first president, and also had the unpleasant experience of being in charge of the first use of the army/militia against American citizens.

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:32 am

Of course we will need write and sign a letter of apology for our moronic military's imperialist transgression. Would you rather see the downed pilots in jail for life?

Rest Pal November 26, 2013 at 7:27 pm

China would probably say "sure, let's borrow your time machine, or wait til we have perfected ours."

Ken November 30, 2013 at 4:25 am

The 1st few words on this article are completely wrong, making the whole article wrong! There is no such thing as a "no fly zone" it's an ADIZ, air defense identification zone. Meaning if u go into this zone u have to notify the Chinese 1st n let them know who u are, there won't be no shooting down even if u go in without permission, at most they will send their Air Force up to stop u and make u leave. A no fly zone is more deadly serious, regardless if u fly into it on purpose or accident, they will shoot it down.

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:15 am

China can simply say "It's somewhere in the South China Sea. Go pick up the pieces yourself. No Navy submarines and Surface Combatants allowed."

hibeam November 26, 2013 at 7:22 pm

B-52s enforce Yes-Fly Zone

Rest Pal November 26, 2013 at 7:22 pm

China might want to consider sending a pair of 1960-era J-6's and down the B-52s next time they fly in the zone. In fact, it would be a great opportunity to test its drones and missiles on the B-52s.

Manny Pacquiao November 26, 2013 at 7:24 pm

Hey commies wanna engage ? 0ur raptors are just around to make u pee on ur diapers

dr. agreeable November 26, 2013 at 7:32 pm

huh?

oblatt2 November 27, 2013 at 9:04 am

No raptors have so much down time its hard to keep even two on alert. And then they don't have the range to do anything.

Benjamin November 27, 2013 at 11:16 am

Senkaku's are well within flight range of Okinawa

Clint Notestine November 27, 2013 at 11:25 am

plus we have this new thing called midair refueling

oblat November 27, 2013 at 9:52 pm

freeamerica November 29, 2013 at 2:15 pm

So, at no time are two F-22's available? Hogwash! Just saying it doesn't make it true. Just makes you look ignorant.

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:54 am

@Manny Pacquiao, last time I checked, F-22 pilots said they were afraid to fly the F-22s. Some pilots even went further and refused to fly the F-22s. You sound as idiotic and ignorant as "freeamerica", STemplar, and Bradford, if not more so. People in the sciences are not interested in Jingoism and their practitioners. You will find better audience on Fox's website.

Big-Dean November 26, 2013 at 7:35 pm

you bet your a.. that there was a couple of AWACS monitoring Chinese "activity" and that we had a few F-22s nearby, outside of the zone, ready to "assist" the B-52's if any Chinese fighters were scrambled.

And again your can bet your a.. that we had a couple of "platforms" near the Chinese coast gathering signal intelligence

and it wouldn't have surprised me at all if those two B-52's were flying the furtherest edge of the "zone" while under an Aegis umbrella

all of these "factors" combined is what the Chinese did nothing

Steve B. November 26, 2013 at 8:13 pm

Not likely. The reason for 2 planes is so there's a "witness" if there's an incident.

The US is not wanting to escalate this at all by staging AWACS and/or F22's into the vicinity of the flight and there's really no reason to.

Simply flying a couple of Buff's on a "previously" scheduled flight (my butt) it was scheduled) sends the required message, especially as it's in the news immediatly

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 9:53 am

The F-22's couldn't penetrate the great "time zone barrier". It is known to be fatal to all avionics on that airplane.

Lance November 27, 2013 at 1:39 pm

I don't think we had F-22s in the Area we do have F-15s but that would have been recorded.

Uranium238 November 27, 2013 at 2:41 pm

I agree. There had to have been F-22s in the area as this would be a somewhat risky flight. The ADIZ has clearly been indicated by the Chinese.

Does anyone remember the incident with the P-3 a while back? I don't think we want the same thing to happen to our B-52s. The Raptor is probably the only aircraft capable of providing top cover while being unidentified. There is more to this story I'm sure.

oblatt2 November 29, 2013 at 12:17 am

>you bet your a.. that there was a couple of AWACS monitoring Chinese "activity" and that we had a few F-22s nearby, outside of the zone, ready to "assist" the B-52's if any Chinese fighters were scrambled.

Fantasy deployments – keeping America proud since 1945 LOL

CaptainObvious November 26, 2013 at 8:00 pm

^^^^ BIG DEAN SUP BRO

mpower6428 November 26, 2013 at 8:58 pm

politics aside…. isn't it cool that these planes are still working…? no just mechanically but, well…. you know.

tiger November 28, 2013 at 11:18 am

Not if your the crew used as bait. They can not out fly trouble or shoot back at it.

orly? November 26, 2013 at 10:05 pm

Sooo… under who's orders?

Do it again, but with B2s like whoever ordered them for Korea.

IKnowIT November 26, 2013 at 11:01 pm

Cool. Glad someone had at least the smallest bit of balls.

Gooit November 26, 2013 at 11:20 pm

It is not a No-Fly Zone, but rather an Air Defense Identification Zone. Anyone's military can fly through them; just like how Tu-95 goes into/through Canada's and American's ADIZ.

Auyong Ah Meng November 27, 2013 at 12:17 am

It is okay for them to declare a air defense identification zone….other countries have done it…

But a air defense identification zone over disputed territories? Really? Seriouly…think about it…

It is like Nazi Germany word of play of extending a air identification zone over parts of disputed territory with Poland and France…..Or Mexico declaring over the same over texas cos it use to belong to Mexico and thus can be disputed…etc….is it truely acceptable… .

Please be careful…they always start with this thing call creeping up to you with words of play or not so serious stuff..until they are right on top of you and it is too late…no amount of regrets or sorrows will recover lost lives when things go south very fast…

That's plain wrong what they are doing….zzzz

Nadnerbus November 27, 2013 at 12:40 am

Like Auyong said. It is a power play by the Chinese to assert more control of a contested region they hope and plan to dominate, at least economically. They figured they could try to ratchet things up with this No Fly, or Identification zone, or whatever you want to call it, and if nobody called them on it, they would have a precedent. Kind of like moving you stuff into someone's place a little bit at a time, 'til one day: surprise! I live here now!

As weak as the Administration has looked on foreign policy lately, I can see how the Chinese thought they might not be challenged on it. It is gratifying to see they were, and promptly so. I have to give a "good job" to the military and the administration on this one. It seems like they took just the right steps to say "nope" without being provocative.

Gooit November 27, 2013 at 2:25 pm

China and Japan have disputed islands in that area. Both of China and Japan's ADIZ covers those disputed islands.

Auyong Ah Meng November 28, 2013 at 1:01 am

I am sorry Gooit…

I understand where you are coming from…

Please leverage on below for a overall holistic understanding…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Defense_Identifi

All i can say someone is trying to see how far the US is willing to go for its ally Japan…

If the US do not support Japan…other countries like taiwan etc in that part of the world will decide … then might as well join China and be her ally….

If the US do not stand by its allies….then all the past blood, sacrifice and tears of those who made the ultimate sacrifice for the present and future…is for nothing.

I am sorry.

Mike Smith November 27, 2013 at 2:07 am

I’m not quite sure why the US has to involve itself in such an obvious manner in Asian disputes. They have enough problems and exponential expenses at home and abroad else where to deal with. I’m not suggesting they clean out ignore what’s happening but equally the increasingly active roll the US is taking in the pacific is just as alarming to me and surely exasperates the territorial disputes China has with its neighbours.

mpower6428 November 27, 2013 at 4:05 am

China has a territorial dispute with every neighbor it has ever had . Incorporation is the only way it ends. Tibet, Manchuria, Mongolia , Russia, Japan, Taiwan, the Philipines, Vietnam, Inida , Nepal…. are there any "neighbors" left…? They're just as arrogant as we are, in their own special way.

Kicking their ass is the only way the Chinese listen. ask " The peoples republic of Vietnam"…. they did.

Jaro November 30, 2013 at 5:47 am

Vietnamese have kicked American ass too, didn't they?

ike November 30, 2013 at 4:27 pm

mpower6428, you don't know what are talking about. If you want to express an opinion, at least make an effort to learn about the region first. Otherwise you are perpetrating and originating false information. The US has stuck its nose in Asian affairs at great expenses to the Americans both in terms of lives and money. The two wars directly or indirectly with China both ended with US defeat. Kicking their ass requires full justification first and then accurate assessment of capabilities on both sides. The only thing you got right is "we are arrogant" but why don't you stop being arrogant if you know you are arrogant?

Benjamin November 27, 2013 at 11:19 am

We have a defense treaty with Japan that has helped keep the peace in that region since WW-II. That treaty mandates that we defend these islands

Rest Pal December 2, 2013 at 7:04 am

Wrong. You never read the treaty and don't know anything about the details. Don't make things up, Ben.

freeamerica November 29, 2013 at 2:22 pm

Issues abroad affect the entire world, including the US.

ike November 30, 2013 at 5:30 pm

and US entanglements have always made things worse, both to parties abroad, and American lives and treasury back home. No offense, but an uneducated, ignorant poster such as yourself should use your own name instead of high-sounding slogans when posting. Better still, peruse, don't post.

freeamerica December 2, 2013 at 1:56 pm

I recommend you get in your time machine and go back to pre-Pearl Harbor attack days and snuggle up to your isolationism beliefs. This is a global time we live in. We must not be apathetic to what is going on outside of the US.

freeamerica December 2, 2013 at 1:57 pm

Ike, why do you have so many people disagreeing with you? Oh, because you are wrong.

guest December 17, 2013 at 7:56 pm

No, it's because there are too many uneducated and uninformed posters.

Just look at yourself.

oblatt2 November 30, 2013 at 3:28 am

Its for domestic consumption – all through history declining powers have tried to recapture the magic of their heyday through counterproductive bluster.

ike November 30, 2013 at 4:47 pm

Aye. That's exactly what it is. The US is in decline precisely because there are simply too many shxt-for-brain wanabe-politicians and wanabe-generals in the country.

guest December 17, 2013 at 7:54 pm

Mike Smith, good question.

I think the answer is the same as when LBJ started the Vietnam War – weapons and defense contractors want big wind falls from wars and their proxies in Congress and the media promote it.

Navy Seal 9009 November 27, 2013 at 7:19 am

I would say the islands are closest to Taiwan, the largest island is 2 miles long and 3/4 of a mile wide the 2 smaller islands are 3/4 mile long by 1/4 mile wide. No one lives on them, so whats the big deal CHINA. At the closest point those islands are 225 miles from the closest little island off the coast of China and about 75 miles off the coast of Taiwan. If they belong to anyone the should belong to Taiwan. There problem fixed!!!!!!!!!!!! Fly til your little hearts content B-52s and escorts. China's fighters with their fuel guzzling copy cat engines would run out of fuel by the time they made it out there anyway unless they carried all fuel tanks just to get a shot with their guns. LOL

Kim Scholer November 27, 2013 at 10:20 am

If the islands 'belonged' to Taiwan, mainland China would still consider them part of the empire. They still insist that Taiwan is a breakout province of China, rather than an independent country. Read up on your history about this….

Bruce November 27, 2013 at 9:52 pm

The deal in this case is not the islands but the resources under them – whoever owns the islands owns the resources.

mike November 28, 2013 at 9:21 am

Chinese morons bullying its neighbors ,you're right their copycat planes are nothing compared to predator drone….go U.S never mind china

Sam Luo March 18, 2014 at 11:57 pm

Really, that's probably what would happen if China used the U.S's planes, thats why we use our J-class planes, so we could beat the crap out of your F/A-18 and F-16's.

oblatt2 November 27, 2013 at 9:03 am

Its not a no fly zone its an air defense warning zone which could happily co-exist with the Japanese one.

The Chinese play the long game – they know that in the end the US will back down. Maybe it will take a few unfortunate accidents with Chinese drones running into non-complying US aircraft to get the point across.

One only needs to look what happened to our electronic monitoring int he 250 mile limit – plane intercepted, crew locked up, lesson learned, we don't do it any more.

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 9:49 am

I hear the Chinese were really intrigued by the B-52s. It's like seeing a piece of history flying. Hell, it's like flying B-17s over Iraq. No one is really scared so much as intrigued by such old aircraft. When you think about it, it really is amazing that we could keep these birds flying 50+ years after they were originally designed. No one in the 1950s would have guessed they'd be flying this long. Had they known, they would certainly be ashamed by what their once great country had become.

Marcel November 27, 2013 at 11:02 am

The reasons the B-52s were used was that they are best way to rub it in the Chinese government's face. They are symbolic of American air power and they show up easily on the Chinese air defense radars. Here we come, here we are, and there we go! You can take your ADIF and shove it up your a$$!!!!

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 1:32 pm

It is easy to get an airplane seen by radar. The B-52 lumbers through the air at Mach 0.7 burning fuel like Saudi Arabia is having a fire sale on the stuff. F we'd be better off converting old L-1011's into bombers. They'll carry a bigger payload, and cruise at Mach 0.98 and they do that on 3 fuel efficient high bypass turbofan engines. The B-52 is fine if you're only enemies are 3rd world crap holes. If we're going to be a big boy country now, maybe it's time to step up our game.

freeamerica November 29, 2013 at 2:30 pm

Step up our game? Like with the B-2? These comments are hilarious.

nics December 6, 2013 at 1:58 am

@Marcel

No. The B-52 are not symbolic of American air power. Besides, America lost to China in the last two military conflicts. There is nothing to rub it with. The B-52 is a piece of junk to a modern air force. It's just for a show of support due Japan, a highly nominal one, as a real war with China in Asia will be ruinous to US military.

Tom November 27, 2013 at 11:12 am

The B-52's of today are not the same ones from the 50's. They have been continually upgraded and modernized. The general look, frame and dimensions are more or less the same, but that's the end of the comparison. I would think that the designers would be damn proud that their design is still projecting American power. They are not scheduled for decommissioning until the 2050's. 100 years!

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 1:26 pm

Yeah, they look brand new. You go on and be a cheerleader right up until the bitter end.

David November 27, 2013 at 6:44 pm

They are bomb trucks. They do their job superbly. They are not first strike weapons. Cruise missiles and stealthy craft take down radar and anti air which allows the B52 to lumber along and drops hundreds of guided weapons such as the SDB.

STemplar November 27, 2013 at 10:06 pm

You're a real ball of joy, blast at a party I'm sure. Are you ever not angry and hateful at the US?

I think the symbolism is obviously lost on you. We absolutely flew our most lumbering easy old target that can be called a war plane not only through their new zone, but over the islands in the dispute to make a point. They point was we not only don't accept the zone but we have so much disdain for it we'll fly our slowest easiest POS to hit aircraft through just to call them out.

Dfens November 28, 2013 at 5:13 pm

I think the "symbolism" of having to turn to a 1950's airplane to do a show of force against the country that supplies most of our manufactured goods is pretty damn obvious. Guess whose war planes are patrolling that airspace today?

guest December 17, 2013 at 7:34 pm

Tom,

you forgot to put "sarcasm" at the end.

Most folks here aren't that sharp.

ITM November 27, 2013 at 4:27 pm

Pilgrimman November 27, 2013 at 10:34 am

Chinese Internet Misinformation Force up in this…

JEMcKellar November 27, 2013 at 12:09 pm

Is there any particular reason why the B-52 was selected for the job? Long enough legs to be staged from US soil rather than an allies? Better countermeasures? Big enough to survive a mid-air collision with a fighter?

It seems they could have routed a C-130 with typhoon relief supplies through the area instead, just to give the Chinese a good chance to embarrass themselves.

FormerDirtDart November 27, 2013 at 12:33 pm

You obviously didn't even bother to read the article.

JEMcKellar November 28, 2013 at 9:08 am

I read it, I'm just not taking that line about a previously scheduled flight at face value. Even if the B-52 flight was scheduled already, somebody made a decision to go ahead with the flight anyway, and not to test the waters with some other kind of flight.

Considering that future operations will be conducted in a complicated patchwork of airspace, it's worth thinking out the value of a long-range bomber in such a situation.

Dfens November 27, 2013 at 1:36 pm

That other 1950s airplane our Air Force just can't get enough of is not nearly scary enough for this job…

bill November 27, 2013 at 3:11 pm

They have a huge radar signature so nobody could miss them flying by. Here we are so what are you going to do?

ike November 27, 2013 at 5:42 pm

the B-52 was selected because it's disposable now. Even if China shoots them out of the sky it won't be much of a loss. The B-52s are obsolete and useless in modern combat.

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:38 am

I'll bet the two B-52s are due for retirement soon. I have no doubt that China will shoot down American military aircraft if deliberate noncompliance continues. China now enjoys air superiority. Its Sukhois and J-10s easily outmatch the F-15s and F-16s. With thousands of various lethal anti-ship missiles, neutron bombs, high-speed torpedoes, and high-energy laser weapons capable of destroying US satellites in minutes, what do they have to fear.

Kim Scholer November 28, 2013 at 11:16 am

The B-52 was the perfect choice for this very symbolic mission: long legs and a proven combat record, showing China (as well as the rest of world) that the US will back up Japan militarily if push comes to a shove. Of course the 'perviously scheduled flight' is complete BS, but again, it was the proper time and place to call it that.

ike November 30, 2013 at 5:41 pm

B-52 is a bomber, not combat AC, and therefore has no proven combat record. A 1960 era Mig-17 can take down half a dozen in less than a minute. You need to use your brain a little harder. The US has no legit reason to risk its survival over a tiny group of rocks off China's coast. Besides, the islands were part of China prior to WWII based on historical documents shown on New York Times.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 5:59 pm

Which means what? Manhattan used to belong to the Dutch and native Americans prior to that based on historical documents. That's a very sophomoric excuse for engaging in the geo political buffoonery being displayed by the Chinese government.

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:48 am

@STemplar, that's a totally nonsensical analogy. What does the history of Manhattan have to do with the fact that the B-52 is a bomber? Gosh you can't even write a simple, valid analogy, and you want to lecture people on something you obviously know nothing about. Save it.

freeamerica December 2, 2013 at 1:33 pm

No offense taken because you are the one who is ignorant. Ignorant of who I am and the Vietnam scenario and as I read more of your posts…just plain ignorant. Your posts went from laughable to lunacy and all of them include vile insults. I know your type, reality isn't part of your daily routine.

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:58 am

ike is right. You are the ignorant one. ike didn't insult you. What part of ike's post is wrong? If you see it as vile insult, then I'd say you should learn to face the truth and reality better.

moronotopia December 3, 2013 at 8:19 pm

The good news is you're not making US Defense Policy. The bad news is that your comments are some of the most infantile I've seen on this board…

westwood December 4, 2013 at 6:06 am

Please halt your infantile personal attacks.

Rick December 17, 2013 at 6:06 pm

Because, its a different story if we were flying stealth bombers in the same area, we are just basically telling China they won't have a free pass to those islands. We flew the biggest aircraft we have that is of tactical use, something they couldn't miss on the radar screen.

Lance November 27, 2013 at 1:41 pm

I doubt China would do anything they want American business to push there economy a act of war would have ended that. Those Islands are far from Chinas shore I doubt they ha enough time to get fighter to that area before the B-52s left for home anyway. Just more saber rattling.

Menzie November 27, 2013 at 2:59 pm

I agree with this policy of not giving in to the bullying tactics of Beijing. But why lie when you say "previously scheduled" maneuvers. We all know it was not previously scheduled, so does China. It is transparent and silly which makes us seem like children.

Jim C November 27, 2013 at 6:15 pm

This is potentially another fine bucket of suds Obama could get us into. He reminds me of myself at 13; I tried to hang with girls 16. Little did I know they were laughing their a—- of.

Kim Scholer November 28, 2013 at 11:07 am

If you have a suggestion for a better response, please let us know.

Jim C November 27, 2013 at 6:16 pm

last word is "off" (Sorry)

oblatt2 November 28, 2013 at 1:26 am

Editorials across Asia point out the hypocrisy of the US position – ignoring Japanese and Taiwanese identification zones while protesting on a Chinese one.

Its pretty clear the Chinese have got what they wanted – a demonstration that any relationship with the US will always be unequal and ultimately exploitative.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 5:26 pm

Post links to the editorials wind bag. Your assertion about tje US not conducting SIGINT flights anymore was a complete fabrication liar.

moronotopia December 3, 2013 at 8:21 pm

I'm pleased that "editorials across Asia" don't have a whit of impact on US decision making. Editorialize away, but keep one eye on the sky…

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:26 am

@moronotopia, how do you know they don't have any impact? Because you are a moron in moronotopia? The US has few friends in Asia. Even in Japan and South Korea, the average folks harbor more resentment than the media dare to reveal or report.

westwood December 4, 2013 at 6:08 am

Most of the world know about the hypocrisy of the US government already. They just don't say it out loud most of the time.

CaptainObvious November 28, 2013 at 12:36 pm

We flew into their ADIZ, maybe had a few sensors turned on. Gathered some SIGINT and that's it. Russia and the US do this all the time – some of you, and the media are trying to paint a more disturbing picture.

Shit, the US does this to China all the time.

oblatt2 November 29, 2013 at 12:18 am

not any more not since the Chinese stopped us.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 10:26 am
Bill November 29, 2013 at 10:08 am

Anothr case in point of sticking our nose in where it don't belong. Will we ever wise
up. Common sense will tell you that it costs China nothing to say they are going to
impose a no fly zone. While on the other hand it costs the U.S. thousands and thousands of dollare to fly missions. I think we should turn the entire DOD over to the boy scouts – at least they have adult leadership.

oblatt2 November 30, 2013 at 3:26 am

The US is telling carriers today that they must obey the new Chinese rules.

The Chinese play the long game – they know that after all the bluster has subsided like the old adage says – the US doesn't mean what it says.

Mama PLA November 30, 2013 at 1:08 pm

We were really tough for a day. Today it is, who cares about those stupid islands anyway? Today all anyone cares about is how much they bought from China on Black Friday. The chest beating is officially over, now it is back to business as usual.

ike November 30, 2013 at 4:43 pm

In the end, the US is nowhere close to being able to match China's firepower along Chinese coast. That's just common sense. Heck, the top brass can't even be sure the Navy and AF can survive a shootout with Iran because of its 1000+ Russian & Chinese anti-ship missiles and SAMs. On this count alone, the US has no business getting involved in the Sino-Japanese dispute. We don't need to go further and consider the bilateral financial, economic and geopolitical repercussions, which would lead to the same conclusion with a cursory examination. The US is in deep shXt already and most people are oblivious to it.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 9:32 pm

What are the three of you? About 12 years old emotionally and mentally? Probably chronologically, remember KAL flight 007? Telling civilian airlines to follow the ADIZ to avoid mistakes is the adult thing to do. The Japanese are being idiots telling theirs not to file flight plans. Keeping civilians out of harms way and protecting them is what adult rational governments are supposed to do.

The idiots in Beijing actually think they are going to individually bully, Taiwan, Japan, Korea, the Philippines, Malaysia, Singapore, and Indonesia, and those countries aren't going to get together and have something to say about. They are a bunch of dullards in a dictatorship whose leaders have never had their ideas and approaches critically challenged. The US is no benchmark and this administration in particular plays it far too politically with national security, but the Chinese are a bunch of linear thimble heads with this latest move.

If they did something to get the Japanese and the South Koreans on the same sheet of music militarily there isn't anything the Chinese could have done that would be much dumber.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 9:36 pm

Sorry, for got to mention Vietnam, Cambodia and Thailand.

oblatt2 December 1, 2013 at 3:17 am

Actually by any objective measure the US isn't even a player in Asia anymore. I don't see any indication that any of the leadership are factoring the US into their countries future. Asian reactions to the B52s has been variations of "its not helpful but what can you expect".

Sailing around with a discredited military is no match for the hundreds of billions of dollars China is pouring into the region. And China has long used industrial policy to effectively contain resistance to its rise.

When your transport network is tied up in 50 year contracts with Chinese firms, China is your biggest market, your greatest source of capital and critical for your manufacturing chain and the guarantor of prosperity for your future – You can see why Americas pitch to "balance that" has been rejected.
And every one of the countries that were staunch US allies are now taking advantage of the new Chinese era. The last thing they want is for the US to come and slow it down.

I remember when the US was a hyperpower and could "make its own reality". Those days are long gone the US isn't even in the game in Asia anymore.

Dfens December 1, 2013 at 10:54 am

Now, instead of a hyper-power we are a hyper-joke. We spend more on weapons and get less than the rest of the planet combined. Our national security is nothing more than a profit line in the accounting ledgers of a few multi-national corporations that laugh at the stupidity of the American people for falling for the same stupid ploys year after year after year.

freeamerica December 2, 2013 at 1:50 pm

Google is your friend. The internet has tons of info on it. Have your grandson show you how to get online and look up military power by country. Pick any site you like. You wanna know how I know you are not worth debating…."In the end, the US is nowhere close to being able to match China's firepower along Chinese coast" OMG, this is the hilarious. China is not even close to the US in ANYTHING military. They are still 30 years behind in technology. They are just now sending a rover to the moon. The US did that in the 60's.

oblatt2 December 2, 2013 at 9:11 pm

Sure we could send men to the moon 50 years ago now we big rides from the Russians to get into low earth orbit.

I don't blame you for living in the past, since your future is so bleak.

Dfens December 3, 2013 at 8:34 am

Assuming China is 30 years behind us, and knowing that the development cycle on American armored vehicles and aircraft is 30 years now, you've got to wonder why any American would be so smug.

freeamerica December 3, 2013 at 3:47 pm

I am way outmatched here. I have learned, in the past, that I cant debate those who can see into the future. You win.

oblatt2 December 1, 2013 at 3:21 am

Remember when we had total air dominance ? – now the air-force talks about trying to create small temporary bubbles of survivability.

Lockheed Martin: We never forget who we're working for – China.

Julia December 1, 2013 at 10:22 am

The Japanese gave up those island colonies after World War II, at Potsdam. Details can be found at the G2mil blog. But the Pentagon needs a new threat to prevent budget cuts.

Dfens December 2, 2013 at 11:54 am

Wrong islands, babe.

joefeds December 2, 2013 at 8:40 am

I believe the Air Force is using B-52s because they are more likely to withstand a mid-air collision that the Chinese would provoke.

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:37 am

Last time was an accident. If a deliberate collision is executed, Chinese jets will smash right into B-52's upper nose, kill the pilots instantly, and destroy all the on-board instrumentation. Can the B-52 survive such a collision?

Stephen December 2, 2013 at 10:56 pm

people go on about the B-52 being old etc.. but you can bet there is a couple out there packed full of Sigint, a big wolf (with big ears) in sheeps clothing.
I admire the Americans for doing this, the Chinese need to be shown you can't just bully your neigbours..
I say if we need each other for trade, Obama should turn of the trade tap for one week,, show them what a bully acn really do…..

gt350 December 28, 2013 at 3:05 am

A B 52 is the Hammer , if it makes it over your airspace and its working its a bad day for U. age doesn't matter, there just a prong in the picture.

ike November 27, 2013 at 5:45 pm

Many American political and military leaders are not "like" children, but ARE children.

Chinese leader on the other hand pretend to be children as a matter of game plan to serve long term goals.

That's my observation at least.

Steve B. November 27, 2013 at 6:21 pm

Lot's of related factors. We sent B52's as they are already stationed at Anderson on Guam, thus within range and can take on the mission quickly and repeatedly. The 52's can carry anti-shipping missiles and the PRC knows this so it's not an idle threat (they just "sortied" their carrier, but with no planes apparently). VB Biden is in China next week so a rapid response makes a statement to the PRC that we're not rolling over on this one. Having to ramp up B1''s or 2's out of the US takes time and sends it's own statement that we are ramping up our capabilities in the region, which itself states we are taking this more seriously then we need to – at this point. We are not using the F22's on Okinawa as why take it to that level, of using our ace-in-the-hole immediately. Keep that card reserved is the best tactic. Ditto with AWACS.

STemplar November 27, 2013 at 10:10 pm

Who's, ours or theirs? Newsflash captain geography, they have farther to fly than we do over the Senakus.

STemplar November 27, 2013 at 10:24 pm

Their long term goal is to piss everyone in their region off at them? Or to slit their own economic throat getting into a war with 2 of the three largest economies in the world? I'm confused….

Kim Scholer November 28, 2013 at 11:11 am

China is pretty new to modern game of imperial aspirations, and their one-party political system has not been good for letting their leaders understand how the outside world sees China. But then the US isn't really good at that either.

ike November 30, 2013 at 5:44 pm

BS.

Dfens November 28, 2013 at 5:18 pm

We are not rolling over? You actually think we would start a war with China over these uninhabited islands? Ha ha ha ha. Yeah, that war would last until WalMart's shelves were empty.

blight_ December 2, 2013 at 10:45 am

Oh, the Harpoon. That anti-ship missile.

STemplar November 28, 2013 at 7:02 pm

Like l said. Life of the party.

oblatt2 November 30, 2013 at 3:32 am

Given the Chinese speed of business I wouldn't be surprised to have the commander at guam receive an email before the planes even landed…

Old plane rusty ?
Need new plane ?
We give you good price, wide range available.
Superior performance.

Contact Candy at Chengdu Aircraft Industry Co

Mama PLA November 29, 2013 at 12:56 pm

Everything is ok, poor baby. Don't let that mean old man make you worry one little bit. All is well in the world.

ike November 30, 2013 at 4:29 pm

No, Bradford. Jaro is right. You don't know what you are talking about. Leave it to others.

ike November 30, 2013 at 5:22 pm

The problem is this: you are wasting our time with your clearly uninformed opinions. I object to your use of the word "think" and "opinion" in describing your posting. That's not "thinking" or "opining". That's simply random "bullshxting". You have a duty to other readers to be accurate and truthful with your information.

STemplar November 30, 2013 at 5:56 pm

Whoa, now there's a well thought out long term comeback. Must be one of the Politburo in Beijing.

Rest Pal December 2, 2013 at 7:19 am

Plus photos of downed US fighter jets plummeting into the sea or burning on the ground.

China has designated the J-31, seemingly a vastly superior jet to the American F-35, for export only. It might be willing to sell US the jet at 30K troy ounces of gold plus 50K troy ounces of silver per copy. Advance payment and IP / non-compete agreement required. Cost of purity tests extra. US dollars and credit cards not accepted.

STemplar December 2, 2013 at 11:10 am

I don't think we'd start a war over them, but I'm beginning to think the dullards in Beijing might.

Dfens December 2, 2013 at 11:51 am

We would give up Taiwan without firing a shot at our bestest buddy and supplier of all manufactured goods. We're not going to war over these crappy islands. We did our cheap little act of defiance, now it's back to kissing China's ass as usual. Hell, we gave up our industrial might without firing a shot, we're sure as hell not going to fire a shot over a few islands no one has ever heard of.

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:11 am

@STemplar, your anti-Chinese attitude means zilch in a contest of military capabilities in Asia. If the PLA sinks a few Japanese warships and down a few dozen Japanese F-15j's, the proper US response should be to offer as a mediator and negotiate a ceasefire. You can be cavalier on your own life, but a war with China might escalate to nuclear Armageddon within 24 hours. There are thousands of American companies in China. Export to China tops 100 billion every year and import from China 3 to 4 times as much. If you think all this can be ignored over a harmless ADIZ or a few tiny islands, you need to check into a mental hospital right away.

blight_ December 2, 2013 at 12:52 pm

Taiwan will defend itself just fine. They'll win over the communists with greed, and welcome Taiwanese businessmen into Beijing with open arms. It'll be unification at the point of a renminbi instead of a gun.

The "Chinese factories" tend to be built by Taiwanese businessmen. I question if Beijing really has the guts to go at Taiwan anymore; and when Taiwan will drop the charade of not owning the People's Republic.

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:18 am

@Dfens, I totally agree with you. Only lunatics would fight on behalf of Japan over a few stupid islands. More importantly, those islands actually belonged to China prior to WWII. The US put them under Japanese administration in a childish attempt to piss off mainland China during the Cold War.

Why should millions of Americans pay with their lives for the mistakes of a few dumbass politicians. Gosh, too many stupid sheeples in this country.

blight_ December 2, 2013 at 12:58 pm

No idea, but looking up BuNo 156511, I found:

" L-3 Communications Corporation Contract Modified on 10/01/2012
Contracting Agency: Defense Contract Management Agency (Dcma)
Contracting Office: Dcma Aimo Greenville Tx

Vendor: L-3 Communications Corporation
**** MAEHR RD
Waco, TX 76705

Description: PDM – EP-3 BUNO 156511

Modification #: 3H
Modification Reason: Supplemental Agreement For Work Within Scope

Award Amount: $0
Category: Aircraft Manufacturing
Product/Service Description: Maint/repair/rebuild Of Equipment- Aircraft And Airframe Structural Components
Award Type: DO Delivery Order
Date Signed: 10/01/2012
Completion Date: 09/30/2012"

0 dollar award? Confused.

nics December 6, 2013 at 4:28 am

@ ifDog, if the Chinese shoot the B-52s down, they are not going to bother picking up the pieces and put them in a crate. They might search for the downed pilots and prosecute them for violating Chinese air space. Imagine seeing headlines about that for a year or two.

freeamerica December 2, 2013 at 1:34 pm

Just wait, he is thinking of a vile insult.

freeamerica December 3, 2013 at 3:39 pm

I just smile at the ignorance. Do you read your posts before you hit submit? Why the heck would China export a fighter that is "vastly" superior and not keep them for itself?

Dfens December 4, 2013 at 8:14 am

You couldn't just not-get-the-joke in silence?

freeamerica December 4, 2013 at 12:51 pm

He is serious so where is the joke? He truly believes what he blogs. Couldn't you just hate in silence?

nics December 6, 2013 at 2:51 am

You should be laughing at yourself. Combat AC means air to air combat aircraft, ie fighters. The B-52 is a bomber, not a fighter. How difficult can this be? Gosh, so many idiots in here.

mpower6428 December 9, 2013 at 3:24 am

"would you rather see the downed pilots in jail for life"…

certainly not but, also not traded away for a continued trade imbalance, loan guarantees and a monetary crises.

lil' "W" is the only president in the last 50 years who has groveled so hard ( and it got no coverage). I only bring it up because I didn't want you to forget….

did you forget yet…?

guest December 17, 2013 at 7:30 pm

Couldn't have said it better myself.

guest December 17, 2013 at 7:44 pm

sorry Bradford, you are very inexperienced in this kind of politics.

What is truly bogus is the US protest using the B-52s.

Now, all US airlines are complying with the new ADIZ requirements. Political posturing only lasts so long. The ADIZ is there to stay, and more may be declared in the coming years.

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